Darth Vader: Ultimate Power

Firstly, let's confirm that Anakin is more powerful than Yoda and Sidious as of Revenge of the Sith:

The Making of Revenge of the Sith wrote:Gillard also reports that the duel will explain how Obi-Wan is able to defeat his protege, even though Anakin has been established as the most powerful Jedi who ever lived.

Star Wars Miniatures Ultimate Missions: Revenge of the Sith wrote:Anakin Skywalker is the most powerful Jedi in over a thousand years.

Even as of Labyrinth of Evil, Anakin is as strong as anybody who'd ever sat on the Jedi Council:

Labyrinth of Evil wrote:Clearly Anakin was as strong in the Force as any Jedi who had ever sat on the Council. But as Obi-Wan had told him time and again, the essence of being a Jedi didn't hinge on attaining mastery of the Force, but on attaining mastery over oneself.

As of Revenge of the Sith Anakin has boundless powers:

Star Wars Databanks: Darth Vader wrote:Skywalker was seduced by the dark side of the Force. His boundless abilities fueled a sense of pride that hastened his fall.

After turning to the dark side, Darth Vader became much more powerful. The only character to tap into level 9, higher than Yoda:

"There’s up to eight levels. Yoda is an eight, Mace Windu is an eight, Obi is a seven, but if you miss a level, it’s a bit like taking drugs to get enlightenment.” Anakin is the perfect example of messing with the established system. “I’ve got him down as an eight or nine, which doesn’t really exist,” says Gillard, before explaining that by turning to the Dark Side, Anakin skipped some essential steps.

Let's make this clear, Darth Vader was close to or on a level that did not exist prior to him in that state. Better yet, these levels aren't to be understated. Obi-Wan Kenobi only went up one level between The Phantom Menace and Revenge of the Sith:

Nick Gillard wrote:"Obi-Wan has gone up one level from Episode I to Episode III, but it's a huge jump from one level to another."

Firstly though, let's make this clear. This tier system was personally used by George Lucas:

Den of Geeks wrote:Gillard also revealed a rating system used by Lucas and himself to define a Jedi’s relative skill, and how it reflects the difference between light and dark.

For those still speculative of the Canonicity of these statements. A similar level system was employed by Lucas during the production of Empire Strikes Back:

The Making of Empire Strikes Back wrote:The idea of Vader using telekinetic powers during his fight with Luke was created during story meetings. There was concern, however, that the audience might think back to the first film and wonder why Vader didn't use all his powers on Ben; but this was easily explained by the fact that Ben was probably stronger than Vader. George Lucas and Leigh Brackett also discussed the different levels of the Force; maybe Ben was a six, Vader was a four, Luke is now at level two.

He's further confirmed to be unparallelled, the deadliest, as a Sith Lord prior to Mustafar:

Star Wars Databanks: Darth Vader wrote:Palpatine elevated himself to the position of Emperor, and dispatched Vader as his ultimate enforcer. With his unparalleled Force abilities, Vader swept through the Jedi Temple.

Pablo Hidalgo, Just The Facts - Episode III, theforce.net wrote:Darth Vader will prove to be the most deadly character in the film.

Vader's power was growing even still after this, after slaughtering the Separatist Council on Mustafar:

Revenge of the Sith wrote:He could feel his power growing, indeed. He had the measure of his “Master” already; not long after Palpatine shared the secret of Darth Plagueis’s discovery, their relationship would undergo a sudden… transformation.

But let's go back to this quote:

"There’s up to eight levels. Yoda is an eight, Mace Windu is an eight, Obi is a seven, but if you miss a level, it’s a bit like taking drugs to get enlightenment.” Anakin is the perfect example of messing with the established system. “I’ve got him down as an eight or nine, which doesn’t really exist,” says Gillard, before explaining that by turning to the Dark Side, Anakin skipped some essential steps.

This is the difference between said levels:

Nick Gillard wrote:"It's like the richter scale, the gap between each level is enormous."

What's the difference in level on the richter scale?



Darth Vader utterly and insanely dwarfs the Revenge of the Sith titans per a scaling system employed by George Lucas himself. The gargantuan differences, as depicted above, means that Vader at his height was so far beyond his peers that any argument for growth on the part of Darth Sidious, etc. isn't even remotely close to being comparable.

Note: This is an updated version of a blog I posted on KMC some four years ago.

Oh dear

yes, lets listen to gillard's and lucas's vast knowledge on how each richter scale lvl vastly dwarfs the previous lvl by thousands of times. i am sure that that is exatcly what lucas wanted. same way that lvl 8 and 3/4 windu could somehow fight sheev, who is miles, LEAGUES above him. thank god vader > sheev as of TFU 2 tbh.

Well said

KingofBlades wrote:Well said

legit, i never know if ur joking or not...

That's obviously just a comparison he's making, that the levels have enormous differences. It wouldn't be the first time in SW where we get numbers that would logically put them thousands of times more powerful than another character, but we can say for ourselves that this is obviously overblowing it.

Any of the Vader = Sidious quotes come to mind ?

Vaelias wrote:Any of the Vader = Sidious quotes come to mind ?

congrats on trivia night btw

For the Richter scale part, I would suggest including this as well:


Credit to Branhole.

lorenzo.r.2nd wrote:

Vaelias wrote:Any of the Vader = Sidious quotes come to mind ?

congrats on trivia night btw

Thank you bud 

So many sources taken out of context. I shall get back to this.

None of this was taken out of context. These are all quotes that have been used in exactly this way by myself, Ant and others.

LadyKulvax wrote:None of this was taken out of context. These are all quotes that have been used in exactly this way by myself, Ant and others.

Just gonna point out one thing now since it's bed time.

The tiering system where Yoda and Sidious were 8s and Anakin was a 9 is outdated, now they are all tier 9s.

Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

iamthatguy boutta shut down AP with some headcanon

Vaelias wrote:iamthatguy boutta shut down AP with some headcanon

You know it.

LadyKulvax wrote:Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

If by ultimate, you're including outdated material such as the retconned tier system, then fair. But if you're referring to evidence that is factual in present times, then I'm afraid I'm not wrong.

great thread collaborates even more what we already know

iamthatguy wrote:

LadyKulvax wrote:Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

If by ultimate, you're including outdated material such as the retconned tier system, then fair.  But if you're referring to evidence that is factual in present times, then I'm afraid I'm not wrong.

Hang on, you are currently preaching the tier system in other threads, make up your mind

Vaelias wrote:

iamthatguy wrote:

LadyKulvax wrote:Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

If by ultimate, you're including outdated material such as the retconned tier system, then fair.  But if you're referring to evidence that is factual in present times, then I'm afraid I'm not wrong.

Hang on, you are currently preaching the tier system in other threads, make up your mind

The retconned tier system is the one where Anakin was the only 9, and Yoda/Sidious were 8s.  The more modern tier system has all three at 9s, which is the one I use.

iamthatguy wrote:

Vaelias wrote:

iamthatguy wrote:

LadyKulvax wrote:Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

If by ultimate, you're including outdated material such as the retconned tier system, then fair.  But if you're referring to evidence that is factual in present times, then I'm afraid I'm not wrong.

Hang on, you are currently preaching the tier system in other threads, make up your mind

The retconned tier system is the one where Anakin was the only 9, and Yoda/Sidious were 8s.  The more modern tier system has all three at 9s, which is the one I use.

Neither one is ‘retconned’ both are valid the one where Yoda is an 8 is just a scaled down version I guess you could say, with Anakin being a 9 only showing how he would be at the higher end of a 9 in the other system

Vaelias wrote:

iamthatguy wrote:

Vaelias wrote:

iamthatguy wrote:

LadyKulvax wrote:Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

If by ultimate, you're including outdated material such as the retconned tier system, then fair.  But if you're referring to evidence that is factual in present times, then I'm afraid I'm not wrong.

Hang on, you are currently preaching the tier system in other threads, make up your mind

The retconned tier system is the one where Anakin was the only 9, and Yoda/Sidious were 8s.  The more modern tier system has all three at 9s, which is the one I use.

Neither one is ‘retconned’ both are valid the one where Yoda is an 8 is just a scaled down version I guess you could say, with Anakin being a 9 only showing how he would be at the higher end of a 9 in the other system

Is that how you worm your way around the fact that it's retconned

iamthatguy wrote:

Vaelias wrote:

iamthatguy wrote:

Vaelias wrote:

iamthatguy wrote:

LadyKulvax wrote:Thanks for proving you literally don't understand what the OP means.

If by ultimate, you're including outdated material such as the retconned tier system, then fair.  But if you're referring to evidence that is factual in present times, then I'm afraid I'm not wrong.

Hang on, you are currently preaching the tier system in other threads, make up your mind

The retconned tier system is the one where Anakin was the only 9, and Yoda/Sidious were 8s.  The more modern tier system has all three at 9s, which is the one I use.

Neither one is ‘retconned’ both are valid the one where Yoda is an 8 is just a scaled down version I guess you could say, with Anakin being a 9 only showing how he would be at the higher end of a 9 in the other system

Is that how you worm your way around the fact that it's retconned

Show me where it was ever said to be retconned please

Darth Vader utterly and insanely dwarfs the Revenge of the Sith titans per a scaling system employed by George Lucas himself. The gargantuan differences, as depicted above, means that Vader at his height was so far beyond his peers that any argument for growth on the part of Darth Sidious, etc. isn't even remotely close to being comparable.

Yeh he is deffo not above DE Sidious lol