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Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

ROTS Council Respect thread Empty ROTS Council Respect thread

on April 2nd 2020, 10:19 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
This is a Respect thread for members of the Jedi Council as seen in Episode 3.
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

ROTS Council Respect thread Empty Shaak Ti

on April 2nd 2020, 10:53 pm
Message reputation : 100% (7 votes)
ROTS Council Respect thread ZGZK0ghNJ1LqJM-Z0NNQpmiCuZpohtbe4qrJs3WqAMqO1pmXd3TiHAv88tUFWOs_lpmoWAbAwKVdxWrw9J1TIeeFPGpVliezvMZEtRnhlOOesh4rC-igprJCY1ocOt36stpCgQtW
Why Shaak Ti is not locked by Galen Marek or by her TFU incarnation






Why Shaak Ti is not locked by Galen Marek or by her TFU incarnation:
First we need to establish the state Shaak Ti was in when she fought Galen Marek. To gauge her base state on Felucia, we can make some comparisons to Old Ben and Master Yoda. 

Jedi deaths actively weakening the Jedi

After and during the Jedi Purge, both Obi-Wan and Yoda are immensely hindered by the deaths of the Jedi.


Obi-Wan reached out to the Force to find him, but met only the thin stirring of a barren world. It was strange to live in a galaxy now that had no Jedi in it. He hadn't realized that he had once felt a humming presence, alive with the Force-ability of his fellow Jedi. It had fed him, and he hadn't even known it.
-The Last One Standing

As Yoda approaches 900 years old, he is slowed down not by age but by a spirit broken after the destruction of the Jedi Order. 
-Star Wars Head-to-Head

In his contest with Sidious, Yoda realises he is overmatched and deserts the fight, perhaps because his spirit has been broken by so many Jedi deaths. 
-Star Wars: Episode III Visual Dictionary

Eyes closed, Yoda gave himself up to the Force. Yes, there it was — the sense of someone reaching for him. Almost, he succeeded. Something brushed close to Yoda … no, someone, someone who felt familiar. And then, suddenly, shock waves ripped through the Force. Jedi are dying. 
-Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith Junior Novel 

Since most, if not all, of the Jedi were no more, that was all the sweeter, though Vader was convinced that Obi-Wan had remained hidden all these years, as had Yoda, assuming the latter had not finally shuffled off into death. Yoda had been very old, after all, and the defeat and deaths of the Jedi could not have helped him age any easier. He could be dead. But it was unwise to make such assumptions about such a powerful Jedi Master. 
-Star Wars: Death Star

Still, he (Ben) hated hiding while Jedi after Jedi was killed by agents of the Emperor’s New Order. He heard every scream of death echo in the force, and his heart broke a little more.
-Heir to the Empire Sourcebook


How much did this affect Obi-Wan and Master Yoda?

Despite Obi-Wan and Yoda (as well as Ti) continuing to meditate and hone their force skills-

-ROTS Council Respect thread VFlnx7TQAW8yjyvVhagTbChc1Tmy8ISnAXIxCUPGTE-K01A3ekPs2SkrY7jzfqKfVAQnpLh89rVzNPL7hzOFCqwCo4SSG3C37P3FaQTq7CtptSbCEuU5yZg9L5ES4Qo3ZEe5PFTh



-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

-they became much weaker in the force, and in combat. How much weaker?
Well, Head-to-head, one of the sources that note Yoda grew weaker due to the deaths of the Jedi, notes Darth Vader is more powerful than Master Yoda (this is also supported by the fact that they, Ben and Yoda, trained Luke to kill Vader in the first place).


Vader proves too powerful for the venerable Jedi Master, who awaits a new hope to help bring balance to the force.
-Star Wars: Head-to-head
This is important because Vader is (far) weaker than the likes of Qui Gon Jinn, or Padawan Kenobi. 


Star Wars Insider 70 wrote:ROTS Council Respect thread WbkIPor0Gf6r65c43tyTnanhOFWhBcLS_rQjGnVNJDlGuP_mQmsFWSMfPjeNOrMAt4v6mJ5XLiSi6Xe6uOdyY7SENA4e6t8PqgOjsz7IFvHaHQSWCnPOztwJ_B41rTJb5rbQGNwj




The general trend of the Original Trilogy Jedi being sub Episode 1 Kenobi and Qui Gon Jinn is repeated throughout many sources, and Head-to-Head: Tag Teams has a battle between Episode 1 Maul, Darth Vader, Episode 5 Yoda and Qui Gon Jinn. I don’t have a scan of the source unfortunately, but it has a pie-chart showing us how much each combatant contributes to the battle (the Jedi’s contributions are higher because it is a team battle) and we see that Qui Gon contributes a little over a third of the battle, Maul a little less than a third, Yoda about a 5th, and Vader about a 6th. So it shows us how Head-to-head quantifies the power drop that our Jedi go through (which is consistent with G-canon in this case). 

How much would this affect Shaak Ti?


Shaak Ti is heavily influenced by stressful situations. 



[size=16]ROTS Council Respect thread Hv_UbcEzBY4bjBsRCAfOh-iEqwVQcX2i68qkRNzRUSJRRKCgp0k97npOUV1396LZjQegF7GCccA5XsHNjJSMdaTtyYqw8f0bdSUOoG5kR3ennQAUFz1diWxtfep3jZRJRQY44Skl
[/size]

-Star Wars Fandex Deluxe Edition

Togrutan’s (Ti included) suffer depression when they are left on their own.


As Togrutas prefer company and normally shun individual independence, those who live solitary lives away from their people can suffer from acute bouts of depression, putting great pressure on themselves to make up for the life they left behind. Jedi Master Shaak Ti recorded some of her own troubles with this problem even as she proudly espoused the Jedi lifestyle. Some attempt to cling to their non-Togruta friends in order to make up for what they miss in their pack-based life back home.
-The New Essential Guide to Alien Species

Combined with this passage-

Obi-Wan reached out to the Force to find him, but met only the thin stirring of a barren world. It was strange to live in a galaxy now that had no Jedi in it. He hadn't realized that he had once felt a humming presence, alive with the Force-ability of his fellow Jedi. It had fed him, and he hadn't even known it.
-The Last One Standing
-it’s quite easy to see why that would be a problem.
 

Ti also has a history of having rather strong reactions to the deaths of her Padawans.


Shaak Ti trained two Padawans in her career as a Jedi Master, but sadly saw both of them fall victim to criminal killers shortly after their passing of the Jedi trials. For years, she secretly kept in her heart the pain of losing Fe Sun, one her students, to the Zeltron murderer Lyshaa, though her Jedi demeanor of detachment hid these emotions. 
- Star Wars Databank: Shaak Ti

And rather strong reactions to her occupation as a warrior.


The conflict had left her both mentally and physically scarred, and on her release from the medcentre, she joined Plo Koon in restorative meditation. She would need all her serenity for the battles ahead.
-Star Wars Fact File #116

On her return to Coruscant, Shaak Ti was treated for her physical injuries and meditated to heal her inner turmoil. She was finding it difficult to reconcile being both a Jedi and a soldier.
-Star Wars Fact File #116

With her preference for peaceful solutions, Shaak Ti found the constant conflict of the Clone Wars a difficult burden.
-Star Wars Fact File #114

We should also consider that just before Order 66, Ti fails in an incredibly important mission.


When the Separatists stabbed at the heart of the Republic with a daring attack on the Jedi Temple, Shaak Ti led the defense of Palpatine alongside Jedi Masters Roron Corobb and Foul Moudama. Both Roron and Moudama fell to General Grievous' attack, and Shaak Ti was bound and rendered helpless as Grievous escaped with the Chancellor as his prisoner. 
-Star Wars Databank: Shaak Ti

This is exacerbated by the fact that Ti was quite close to the Chancellor (which would also be a nasty surprise once she figured out who he really was, not really going to help with her mental fortitude).

Supreme Chancellor Palpatine himself officially commended Shaak Ti for her efforts and notable actions on Dagu, Geonosis and Centares. He grew to trust Shaak Ti and her abilities, keeping her as part of his inner circle of protectors during the increasing dangers of the Clone Wars.
-Star Wars Databank: Shaak Ti


While non-continuity, we see what could’ve happened were Ti to have been captured by General Grievous, and “her spirit is broken” and “she apologizes for her failure”, so I think we can assume that her failure to save the chancellor would’ve at least been weighing on her for some time to come.


Shaak Ti's fate vacillated during the production of Episode III. She was originally scripted as being held captive aboard General Grievous' flagship at the start of the movie. Assigned to protect the Chancellor, Shaak Ti was also taken prisoner by the Separatists forces. When Obi-Wan and Anakin are investigating the cruiser, they come across a strangely despondent Shaak Ti sitting at General Grievous' feet. Her spirit broken, Shaak Ti apologizes for her failure, right before she is stabbed in the back and killed by Grievous.
-Star Wars Databank: Shaak Ti

Although her earlier death at Grievous' hands was completed and included on the DVD as a deleted scene, it should not be considered the canon version of her fate. This is because she is still visible later on in the movie as part of the Kashyyyk hologram. The deleted scene on the DVD, "General Grievous Slaughters a Jedi," should instead be considered an interesting look at what might have been.
-Star Wars Databank: Shaak Ti

This is hardly the mentality with which you’d want to bear the hardships of the Jedi purge. 
So it stands to reason that Ti would be affected by the Jedi Purge more, or at least similarly to how Kenobi and Yoda were, and she should relate to her prior self in a way not unlike to how her contemporaries do. We can use one fight to gauge (imo the bare minimum) this difference: 
Obi-Wan Kenobi versus Count Dooku in Attack of the Clones. As Yoda started out at least equal to Count Dooku but then became far weaker than AOTC Kenobi, it’s reasonable to say that Felucia Ti relates to ROTS Ti in a similar manner.

If we were to graph this gap (without long convoluted scaling chains between ROTS Yoda and Darth Vader, but that only widens the gap), we could imagine this:

ROTS Council Respect thread CEfIjAGzmbhgOk4MT4hn4nghbgHj3Rv_-Iu_-cR8n_fU4Oan5oTUX15uzekSr7d_FA-fQi22NcbNqNiln96qf2Airjfejp5HEWcYOfPrca_xPLXM2sQyLiSXgdZPmDphLprEnsRs




This is a good simplified representation of Shaak Ti’s base on Felucia compared to her prime. But this still isn’t accounting for the hindrances she faces that are unique to the events of The Force Unleashed.

Spirit breaking on a smaller-scale

On Felucia, much the same was happening as in the galaxy at large. Many of the Felucians who Ti was training have been killed, and this would have the same force-dampening effect as the wider Jedi Purge, particularly since these Felucians have been trained by Shaak Ti in the Jedi Arts. 


While Shaak Ti focused on training the native shamans in the ways of the Force, Brood wandered off on her own, testing her skills against the planet's hostile wildlife and exploring the Force along her own path.
-The Force Unleashed Web Preview 2 on Wizards.com

 ROTS Council Respect thread NHNu6An8yUd1JaROAQQmVOzEYUWK6l5jhKEuJbeMV5FxGRAeRbrcBwUWGJwajaQIZPlR-Qi25ElrqoiyQN-FTuWTZCfjAyY0-q1pFdtlkNGDlAgzbqZhtyyDNZ9cW_ozOMGZa7uM
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide
ROTS Council Respect thread V40LxJ7D0wFr8VZxSbnzNeIXMMjjwoMX3fyQj4rpENTa5HyUkMnfqbeXP9X-QEtJIUDzwiaidWeQUxegc6FSy2G6R6-FV1OiJP9JhlkjxVMpxRFaZ2IfnP_U-cwzmh0JLtrfHfRc
-The Force Unleashed Official Prima Guide

And we’ve seen how Ti reacts to the deaths of those she has personally trained, but in-case you need a reminder…


Shaak Ti trained two Padawans in her career as a Jedi Master, but sadly saw both of them fall victim to criminal killers shortly after their passing of the Jedi trials. For years, she secretly kept in her heart the pain of losing Fe Sun, one her students, to the Zeltron murderer Lyshaa, though her Jedi demeanor of detachment hid these emotions. 
- Star Wars Databank: Shaak Ti

As for how many Felucians you end up killing, it’s never explicitly stated but the prima guide says that you are to kill ‘many’ Felucians and you do end up killing 4 Shamans and one Chieftain, who are tribal leaders, this to me at least suggests that you’ve killed a fair number (100+) of them. 


ROTS Council Respect thread OztWqUF6mfh5DkymzsNsv7KGZoEjbqKxHgj2O4gR_BGtXWSi9LwfmAYC2FWSNXb73DAeXNstGL827kveYzob87aVCr_4lBuhlXGkgoB7qvLnYwQvy112Kzn7LINTzakxRRqmZXiP




ROTS Council Respect thread 0qgHcbGmv7cyPBKNqMmmgX00c9e271KiJvnRc_rpisR03Fx3VaVlXzzg_GA04dKSfM8YlwA6wI-524LbW_zCn6yxOHtSgiDKZQ4261Nzd-FL7wGKtX8QwOf8xg3WKqfIEekzNAPz




ROTS Council Respect thread JrcY4U2mq-Wg7NIJmjHS-qQwwk1Gz7-5ar2Hls-UVIsjCE-S-RWnP8ncPo6uhITl7Ks5-wBAzaq_DdkTky65zDZULgscYLb5nTnN1dVhq-tR4ovgPsDemUQYKyI4d4pkqvw7AiDk



ROTS Council Respect thread LxHKx3LnAUsmimP1qM-YUz1xmgrBIKdeUbyzYn8WGfgPsvCzsq--ZO1Jqxo8a6p-bX1RMClGmlqTbc9Vr9Ijx5U8Vx8AVGHBjOAhKscLNaywF-IIl4TYFDUaXQbPlHeyJsOYugG-
-The Force Unleashed Official Prima Guide



But the fact that there were thousands of Felucians concentrated in a single-area later lends credence to the idea that number could be far higher.


A war seemed to be breaking out between a herd of angry rancors and thousands of Felucian scavengers over a single, giant carcass.
-The Force Unleashed 


Unlike Yoda and Obi-Wan, who seemed to have some backlog before the Jedi deaths started to affect them in full (likely because they steeled themselves for one last battle), Ti is already seeing the effects once she fights Galen.


She gasped and staggered backward. Her lightsaber and her gaze dropped. A full half meter of red blade emerged from her stomach, then the rest came free with a hiss.
He backed away, shocked by how close he had come to death and how lucky he had been to defeat her. He had raised his lightsaber by reflex. She had, in the desperation of her final assault, practically thrown herself on the blade. Perhaps she had meant for the two of them to defeat each other at the same time.
-The Force Unleashed 

Here we see that Ti is, seemingly, hoping to die in her fight against Galen Marek. This flies in the face of her previous goal (that being to prevent Maris Brood’s fall to the darkside). Rather she is abandoning her padawan and the Felucians to the darkside, which really shows just how badly Ti was affected by this second Purge. While Galen also seems to attribute this sacrifice to desperation, she hardly seemed to be in a desperate position in the fight itself.


She smiled in mockery. "Are you prepared to meet your fate?" Then her lightsaber was lit and she was spinning through the air toward him, striking downward as she fell.
The apprentice simultaneously backflipped and blocked her opening blow. The force of it surprised him, and the recoil threw him backward. His hood caught on one of the sarlacc's teeth, and he tore it impatiently away before the snag could interfere with his defense. Shaak Ti's lightsaber was a jagged blue blur between them. He blocked her as best he could until he had his balance again.
Then he jumped. Over her he spun and fell down two layers of teeth toward the mouth of the sarlacc. From there he jumped up again, angling away from her to avoid giving the Jedi the advantage of height, but she was there ahead of him, driving him back down with a series of blows so rapid he barely caught them all.
In desperation, he summoned a bolt of Sith lightning and sent it down, into the flesh of the sarlacc. The beast roared and shook, giving him the opening he needed. Shaak Ti's right foot slipped, forcing her to flip elegantly out of reach of his blade. He leapt after her, swinging as he came.
The fight progressed around the sarlacc's center rings, blow and counterblow accompanied by the roaring of the beast. The apprentice cut off teeth and threw the fragments at his adversary's head. In return she took tighter control of the beast's distributed intelligence and sent its food-seeking tentacles flailing for him. He repulsed them and fought on.
Down they drove each other, closer and closer to the very lip of the creature's enormous mouth. The air was foul down there, heavy with digestive by-products and the stink of rotting meat. Ghastly exhalations rolled over them as the sarlacc roared on. The apprentice was running out of teeth to sever, so he resorted more and more frequently to Sith lightning and random slashes of his lightsaber to keep it twitching underfoot. Thick ichor leaking out of the wounds made the footing even more treacherous.
"You can't keep this up forever," he taunted Shaak Ti as they dueled.
"Neither can you," she said. "You are wasting your strength too quickly."
"The dark side is inexhaustible."
"Your strength is prodigious," she admitted, "but that is your doing. Light, dark..." She paused to aim a blow at his head that he barely deflected. "They are just directions. Do not be fooled that you stand on anything other than your own two feet."
He slashed at her own feet as they spun by overhead and sent one of her ribbons twirling down into the sarlacc's gaping mouth. "Spare me the philosophy lesson, Jedi," he snarled. "I'm only here for your blood."
"And you may yet have it, or I yours."
On her last three words, she struck three blows that each partially found their mark. The first burned a sizzling line down the apprentice's left shoulder. The second scored diagonally across his chest. The third would have skewered his right eye had he not held her back at the last minute with a desperate telekinetic block that stopped her lightsaber barely a millimeter from his skin. He could feel his eyelashes and eyebrows burning. The right side of his sight was entirely blue.
She gasped and staggered backward. Her lightsaber and her gaze dropped. A full half meter of red blade emerged from her stomach, then the rest came free with a hiss.
He backed away, shocked by how close he had come to death and how lucky he had been to defeat her. He had raised his lightsaber by reflex. She had, in the desperation of her final assault, practically thrown herself on the blade. Perhaps she had meant for the two of them to defeat each other at the same time.
-The Force Unleashed

She must’ve been affected fairly badly if she’s attacking Marek in such a way, when desperation clearly wouldn’t be the cause given how the fight had been going before. Whether the assault was born out of impatience or suicidal intent, it’s clear she is not at the top of her game here.

Which makes sense, as Ti is very closely connected to the nexus of Felucia, and would be heavily influenced by the disturbances in its force.

Shaak Ti's death affected them deeply, so profoundly entangled had she become in the energy flows of the world.
-The Force Unleashed

Were we to graph this hindrance, while it is perhaps not as extreme as what she had faced in the Purge, it would still likely be a huge weight on her shoulders.

ROTS Council Respect thread HWeV3zDiUBXZz0XT-iXty7KKNVhLyQXGVpAsF667X9iaGQZTNQ7JS0XxXCXOHrnduWbIN-Kv-0OdpYoxs0upIXeyWMdQit_rgqSBeuygyro-W11RbIKB_kyekhlMV-BOtaSl3voc



Nexus keeper

We mustn't forget that Shaak Ti is preventing Felucia’s Nexus and people from turning to the darkside.
ROTS Council Respect thread YU3o8G0jqMuVoEVf48kJ0upK3aD2bSsJQREdcIsRM1zbt66t42G0hTNudFr0j3NoNjM1mj88v2s48qlpZr1Bvd_LY9MAFzpQJjwBLGDmzb0WRGzXLGhpK-r5dnCcgea7LHOs7SvF
-The Force Unleashed Official Prima Guide
ROTS Council Respect thread ZiKig9mU72Nx3YvF0YpSvxt3VJskkOHQmeWuagHwzcOEp3sCuHmrOcahEvXYoTc8Nwy4UwUNIKQZmBiRSAk31r0C7My0c4RnkzYhcjJd-_fIhQ6LG4Wh21tuyTn-Y9oH4Xl7dXXU
-The Force Unleashed Official Prima Guide

Early in the game, when the living force is strong and the dark side is being held at bay by Shaak Ti, the planet is beautiful, bright, and multihued. After Shaak Ti’s death, the dark side corrupts the planet and its inhabitants; the planet then shows signs of rot and decay.
-The Art and Making of The Force Unleashed

Kota leaned closer. "Don't be overconfident, boy. Felucia is a world finely balanced between the light and dark sides of the Force. Shaak Ti was the only thing keeping it from being consumed by darkness. If anything's happened to her, your experience in the hut will seem like a bad dream in comparison."
-The Force Unleashed

Galen presumably told Proxy this:


“The darkside was strong on Felucia… … and Shaak Ti was a beacon in that darkness.”
- Proxy in Star Wars: The Force Unleashed Comic
And we can see where he got that from.

She had taken a world enjoying the normal flows between the light and the dark sides of the Force and twisted it out of balance. There was still darkness on Felucia, but it was stifled, frustrated, weakened. He strained to awaken it, to remind it of its proper place in the universe. The light side had held sway for far too long. It was time to redress the issue. Killing Shaak Ti would do that quite nicely.
-The Force Unleashed

I’ve seen arguments in the past for why this might not be due to Ti’s force presence, but I think it’s time to put that to rest.

First of all, the native Felucians are incredibly susceptible to the Darkside and are very tempermental.


My Master later told me that the whole of Felucia was like a single living thing. The planet was strong in the Force… but it was chaotic, wild… sliding toward the dark side. All of Felucia's inhabitants were susceptible. All were on the verge… of becoming monsters! Fortunately, my Master had some experience battling monsters.
- Proxy in Star Wars: The Force Unleashed Comic


ROTS Council Respect thread 9WpDE96MOp2lT8jyEoHZYWacCWz8lgfZM06mNZWA_YgcGIILVyGYsBcSHcq3RwTGeDolApHg-uR-H2inRh4u5H4xX-OcDI4MxxtxgkfXcKuMdE88fVF1IciwHxkSfXArzp1s9kLu
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

It’s rather hard to imagine that they would react well to the ripples in the force signifying their fellow’s deaths. (Which to show this would be a factor in the Force Unleashed specifically, I’ve decided to present some TFU based sources regarding the ripples).


When Palpatine issued Order 66, Maris and her Master were in the Outer Rim Territories and thus not immediately affected by the Purge. But her Master did feel the ripples in the Force caused by the sudden deaths of so many Jedi.
-Star Wars Databank: Maris Brood, also repeated word for word in Star Wars The Complete Encyclopedia A - G

Eyes closed, Yoda gave himself up to the Force. Yes, there it was — the sense of someone reaching for him. Almost, he succeeded. Something brushed close to Yoda … no, someone, someone who felt familiar. And then, suddenly, shock waves ripped through the Force. Jedi are dying. 
-Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith Junior Novel 

Now, all that said, the Felucians did not turn to the darkside during this, despite already being on the verge of doing so. As a matter of fact, Maris Brood had to actively corrupt the Felucians after the fact to make them fall to the darkside. 


The Jedi Apprentice Maris Brood, after hiding out on Felucia and turning to the dark side, corrupts several Felucian shamans and trains them to tap into the more sinister aspects of the force.
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

Fueled by her anger at Shaak Ti for abandoning her, horror at the carnage of her Master’s death, and isolation on the dangerous planet of Felucia, Brood descends towards the dark side. She continues training the shamans in the Jedi arts but, colored by her rage, corrupts many of them into turning to the dark side.
 -The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

When Maris took control of the native Felucians, they, too, embraced the dark side, transforming into hideous monsters that stalk the planet.
-The Force Unleashed Official Prima Guide

This leads to some interesting lines of thought, because under normal circumstances the Nexus’s balance might be threatened by a single shaman falling to the darkside. 
ROTS Council Respect thread RAqn6e3Z0LDuvvj6I2q7FNj-hYmSopSCPDzuufXtWq2DZtrFDo68bAtT5MK-cIfPb31Trx7HHaZmtr3GW56qbkRact7w5q3hu-PZTLXiLgdf1zYUA1Uvo3r9vKZpHQt3rMwoj_5s
ROTS Council Respect thread QRrgaCuQzhm2ZIzf7o205BZHmhug3akCjMDYsIPryUZtCvbFAWfCJwLBwxCVFTBwwxs8wIp-E65UZSglKyMfi8eN7zZAd4J8-s7VJ5cOEfnPShetP6GaGPxSMUw5X3vyhmV_c5oy
ROTS Council Respect thread Irb278IZdAsNdhzTqggZ2WCBUNxnSEzimJ8T5UGYAVUrtDHByx4S1JSU81KsRlZiXBKyScQAwnHOq2Ga9SQYJkfD2M-XGVyDhHMF7SdlgVfnQkUcUm9KIOfY5PY_VZ76vzLSFCUE
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide



Or even less prolific disturbances, as the force’s balance is “ever-shifting” whereas shamans only “sometimes” fall to the darkside.
ROTS Council Respect thread Uftr2pRUy08ISys-mniMzf12voyK1Y6bFAjRI59o9K-ttmgc1QafKG1E_bbq2QIS60_aa593EemNHilFWeScBxg_FtVANxgMQMliC3j-cO6-mkMbTYx2E2CZu0VDJCy7ZA18oTGn
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide



ROTS Council Respect thread CgmTk0Q1XAc0a0x_jkDaulCK7S21D79lh_gyOSGRPlNj_UYxKu1D1z3p6it_iC0w1jV-npkvt1xCGArFAy28FgqMWF1arFY2I7BAla9ZDc1a_nLflpn0AQPHq2618mfPCTc0hYLT
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide



It seems strange that lesser disturbances than Felucian shamans could tip the alignment of the nexus when Galen Marek couldn’t. This observation proves 2 things:
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[*]Shaak Ti was actively keeping the force nexuses and Felucians’ force alignment in check, not her training.

[*]Shaak Ti didn’t normally manage the nexuses ecosystem, nor individual’s alignments (which makes sense).

[/list]

Observation 2 rational: 
Ti didn’t normally actively manage the balance of the force on Felucia because that would’ve drawn the Empire’s eye. Which they wouldn’t have wanted to do because they went to Felucia specifically to seek refuge from the Empire.


During the Dark Times, the Jedi Shaak Ti and Maris Brood seek refuge here from Imperial Inquisitors.
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide
ROTS Council Respect thread X9IKu5C7sIzShOWCccVz3UnRhPnEDeweCvMZYbV5ay7YAYMIUHU8XNGJ9usC6HeiHvYokksznPUyPWRA62jyI7xEb7GuM66U5NQk5AifZQnEyjLIqPmeOzcbuj5NA6CPyiOL1OgV
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide
ROTS Council Respect thread 4HYf_W-ttsBRMF0GBNvni3gaoC90aXB3EXmjGfgrqkcQIpl9tPIJi2-2looRXiNiw8vUM5uSExLgm002qTjqXKkPekZINT_LKusW1eHpKhL5_ZzR1IsvyPxUk8_08f7ftVvnlUyH
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

She’s obviously not hiding in TFU though. 


Getting to her, however, was proving to be something of a problem. Although he had sensed her clearly from orbit as a deformation in the Force, much like a body of mass deformed the fabric of space-time, he hadn't anticipated the dense flows he would encounter on the surface. 
-The Force Unleashed 

And this shows the gargantuan effect Shaak Ti’s power has on this world. Whereas before when she was hiding her presence the balance would be shifted by any little thing that happened, and individual Felucians could turn to the darkside for very little reason, and would struggle with it constantly, after Ti started actively managing the nexuses alignment, individual Felucians (you know that highly emotional species on the verge of being monsters) wouldn’t turn to the darkside even when the many deaths of their friends echoed in the force. They also wouldn’t turn when a force agent far more powerful than the Felucian Shamans (Galen Marek) was introduced to the balance.

As a matter of fact, Ti is even countering Galen Marek’s active attempts to turn the balance of the nexus.


She had taken a world enjoying the normal flows between the light and the dark sides of the Force and twisted it out of balance. There was still darkness on Felucia, but it was stifled, frustrated, weakened. He strained to awaken it, to remind it of its proper place in the universe. The light side had held sway for far too long. It was time to redress the issue. Killing Shaak Ti would do that quite nicely.
-The Force Unleashed

This is made even more impressive considering that killing powerful force sensitives actually empowers the darkside user who has killed, so Galen’s power should be growing up to when he fights Ti, while Ti’s power is lessened by the heartbreak as established earlier.


Yoda senses that a mysterious Sith is becoming very powerful, but he does not know who it is, or what he is planning. Suddenly, the truth is revealed. The clone troopers receive Order 66 from Darth Sidious--it tells them to turn on their Jedi generals!
-Star Wars: The Legendary Yoda

This only seems to happen when a Sith Lord directly kills someone (at least to this extent) but the context of the quote makes it clear the Sith Lord in question is Darth Sidious, as the truth about what the Sith Lord whose power is growing is planning is what is revealed. Sidious, evil as he is, wouldn’t really be going through any emotional growth, and Anakin joining the Sith should dilute the power of the darkside if anything, so we’re left with the Jedi deaths as the cause of that growth.

So Galen’s later (completely useless) attempt to wrest from her control the allegiance of the Sarlacc, while she’s still managing the alignment of the planetary nexus and it’s people, really shows us how vast the power disparity between Shaak Ti and Galen Marek is even after Galen’s crusade. 


He smiled, letting anger fuel his hatred for her and for all that the Jedi represented. With the dark side behind him, he reached out for the mind of the sarlacc and goaded it to lash out at her.
All the creature did was roar. It resisted him, he realized, with her help.
-The Force Unleashed

If we were to graph this, Ti’s usable power would look a little like this.

ROTS Council Respect thread Kad-8fI2f5j1PtBZJZp4M0ur0q88Tp3WkjWzdPOVS83ppAGnaJwlSmqqnsZFj6visnVO1gKPiuKV4ScWhYut4cTZFVhx_ZA9B_5zA2zFY3O4hrCdKdmhVneOUZIgJGE9emllQ-Rm




It’s also important to note that even Ti’s residual presence after her death was keeping the nexus and it’s people neutral, as was noted earlier, Maris Brood had to actively train and corrupt the (as we know) highly emotional and reactive Felucian natives to turn them to the dark side. 


The Jedi Apprentice Maris Brood, after hiding out on Felucia and turning to the dark side, corrupts several Felucian shamans and trains them to tap into the more sinister aspects of the force.
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

Fueled by her anger at Shaak Ti for abandoning her, horror at the carnage of her Master’s death, and isolation on the dangerous planet of Felucia, Brood descends towards the dark side. She continues training the shamans in the Jedi arts but, colored by her rage, corrupts many of them into turning to the dark side.
 -The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

When Maris took control of the native Felucians, they, too, embraced the dark side, transforming into hideous monsters that stalk the planet.
-The Force Unleashed Official Prima Guide

This is a far cry from the ever-changing nexus that shifted from every little thing before Ti started releasing her power. 

This shows us that Ti’s remaining essence still had more influence on Felucian natives (who were “on the verge of becoming monsters” to begin with) than Maris Brood, at least for a time. This is impressive because Maris Brood is on a similar combative level to Galen Marek.


Maris Brood is tough because you are on her level, you're better by a bit but she is able to match you.
-The Force Unleashed Developer Commentary Pt. 4

That Maris Brood is on a similar combative level to Galen suggests her force power is actually superior to Marek’s. This is because Shaak Ti didn’t actually train her Padawans.
ROTS Council Respect thread ZsFa8dASCq3zZFBWh7yHL-BQl1Hct291HQcwQMQ0BvfR3pezEui3D90stqFtFvVng_PMakq8JmC9OXyhMcD6uXctErzFIN0MOfl2UnFIAOFuLOBScVMc97z71eVr1uc_Aqj5TbjR

ROTS Council Respect thread 1BKjHdeO5KbOcNZFAoGTYhIbj1wXjt1qGWJfhlclAQdBont9amDVIkYpmdM6t9NgHPVth8EEaayL_tu0lFQXJfSafzJp1uS7Vlfjv36kPBulUrf42tKQslL5bVyCeQKFydQKNal6
-Power of the Jedi Sourcebook

This training style is supported by the fact that Brood was just left to go do her own thing.
ROTS Council Respect thread AquAffBf4rq7RKtGPUVgFO-MDmF2xkf5-fuaSBno8AeWA63PTP530GLRGS-0k7vvfNk3ddpiQPLUAgXlrKgGApWvu5twpukJ0d51-xrjQ5gbEcqyA23ezqiQ2BBYhVRIZB3G-Iyz
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide
ROTS Council Respect thread H8UoF-5JbbVAU9ZFKvTM9stPhEnVuqjeExHibnWaskXrQgbyCuQ8AKKdPyEVxztkJ_LdQ0sK88X1zqQp8nMmDwm3o5QhxD2tcqThJql3Qb-Ri9ZdtnYILzjOp9m0T5m5LZvxhiZk
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide


Given that the planet’s shifting Nexus has to do with the power of the agents of light and dark, this means that even Ti’s residual presence is stronger than Galen Marek, as Maris Brood had to train shamans to turn them to the darkside before she could corrupt them and help shift the nexus’ and natives’ balances. 

The Jedi Apprentice Maris Brood, after hiding out on Felucia and turning to the dark side, corrupts several Felucian shamans and trains them to tap into the more sinister aspects of the force.
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

Fueled by her anger at Shaak Ti for abandoning her, horror at the carnage of her Master’s death, and isolation on the dangerous planet of Felucia, Brood descends towards the dark side. She continues training the shamans in the Jedi arts but, colored by her rage, corrupts many of them into turning to the dark side.
 -The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide

What force capabilities does this scaling afford Ti?

Now keep in mind, the force feats in The Force Unleashed are exaggerated:


The game’s biggest star, however, is not a flesh and blood creature, but something more elusive yet paramount to Star Wars’ cross-generational appeal: the Force. Explosively paced, over-the-top, no-holds barred Force battles are the crux of the gameplay and members of the development team are taking great pains to ensure that you will utilize the force in ways never seen before.
-Star Wars Insider 93: Unleash Your Inner Sith

Your character will start his adventure with four core Force powers - push, grip, repulse, and lightning - all of which are amped up to staggering degrees.
-Star Wars Insider 93: Unleash Your Inner Sith

The way the force is being utilized is “perfect for a video-game” according to George Lucas. And once again the portrayal of the force is “over-the-top” “amped” and “out of control”.

ROTS Council Respect thread -aaWqCw-hXU92H6Ps26TshjrZSmQokwQzq3inVW5jebhh3gMm23r4a6ACQ_5TyFXY7Sgklr5SrfTFdOgtbF0CYBsmPWRPC5q2tMH6Q2-mrdQylo9UCdF76MxHDGeCgwuWGier8k-



So the feats and scaling found in this medium should only really be used against similarly exaggerated mediums and feats, and not indicative of Shaak Ti’s placement on their own. It’s incredibly likely that anyone from Aayla Secura to the likes of Kit Fisto or Agen Kolar would be portrayed in a similar manner, so it may be best to think of this as how powerful a Council level Jedi is in the dark times.

A quick reminder of how Ti relates to Galen.

ROTS Council Respect thread Kad-8fI2f5j1PtBZJZp4M0ur0q88Tp3WkjWzdPOVS83ppAGnaJwlSmqqnsZFj6visnVO1gKPiuKV4ScWhYut4cTZFVhx_ZA9B_5zA2zFY3O4hrCdKdmhVneOUZIgJGE9emllQ-Rm




Instead of copy-pasting Galen’s feats and scaling up to this point from Azronger’s Galen Marek respect thread, I urge you to go and read it instead.


Placement: Accolades and Explanations:
Shaak Ti is a powerful Jedi Master.


Shaak Ti is a powerful Jedi Master. Her highly refined Jedi skills are extremely useful in the battle against Count Dooku and the super battle droids.
-Shaak Ti (Jedi Master) Star Wars Saga Series #10, 2002

Shaak Ti is one of the most powerful Jedi.

After an inconclusive victory against Rahm Kota, and a more final one against the mad Paratus, Starkiller takes on a far more formidable foe in this classic scene: Shaak Ti, one of the most powerful Jedi.
-Star Wars Insider #140 (Credit to WollfMyth209 )

Shaak Ti has legendary strength in the force.

Shaak Ti is a Master of Makashi and Ataru forms in addition to her legendary strength in the Force. 
The Clone Wars Adventures (Credit to WollfMyth209 )

Among the Jedi Council, Shaak Ti is noted to be powerful. 

One of the few remaining Jedi after Order 66, Master Ti was a powerful and respected member of the Jedi Council--and a perfect target for Darth Vader’s secret apprentice.
-The Art and Making of The Force Unleashed

Shaak Ti has extreme skill with the lightsaber.

Ti is a highly skilled lightsaber duelist backed by a group of Force-using natives of the planet, as well as a sarlacc.
Star Wars Insider #140 (Credit to WollfMyth209 )

As well as being recognised for her serenity and wisdom, the Jedi Master was extremely skilled at using a lightsaber. Her exceptional abilities as a warrior probably came from the mix of her notable perception of the Force and her natural heritage.
-Star Wars: The Official Figurine Collection #49 (Credit to Jake)

Shaak Ti’s saber skill amazed her instructors. 


With her enormous willpower and a great sense of discipline, the young Togruta soon amazed her instructors by developing especially impressive skills with the Lightsaber.
-Star Wars: The Official Figurine Collection #49 (Credit to Jake)
Shaak Ti is considered to be among the greatest duelists in the Jedi Order.

Shaak Ti was considered to be one of the greatest lightsaber duelists in the Jedi Order
-Star Wars Fandex Deluxe Edition (Credit to Jake)

The Jedi revere Shaak Ti as one of the highest of their Order, and one of the most accomplished in lightsaber combat, of which she mastered the Makashi and Ataru forms.
-Star Wars UK Magazine 6.17 (Credit to WollfMyth209 )

The Jedi revere Shaak Ti as one of the highest of their Order and among the most accomplished in lightsaber combat.
-The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide (Credit to WollfMyth209 )

Although to further clarify where among the greatest Ti ranks, to contend with Shaak Ti one would have to be among the greatest duelists in the Order themselves.

Shaak Ti is a Master of Makashi and Ataru forms in addition to her legendary strength in the Force. Known far and wide as a cunning and serene Jedi, only the most skilled of the Order could stand against her!
The Clone Wars Adventures (Credit to WollfMyth209 )



And when the epitome of Makashi grace is described, Ti is mentioned in place of other potent Makashi specialists such as Ki-Adi Mundi or Cin Drallig, which is impressive as Mundi was considered to be one of the top ten duelists of his age, and Cin Drallig had unparalleled skill with a lightsaber. 

There is an understated elegance in Obi-Wan Kenobi's lightsaber technique, one that is quite unlike the feel one might get from the other great swordsbeings of the Jedi Order. He lacks entirely the flash, the pure bold elan of an Anakin Skywalker; there is nowhere in him the penumbral ferocity of a Mace Windu or a Depa Billaba nor the stylish grace of a Shaak Ti or a Dooku, and he is nothing resembling the whirlwind of destruction that Yoda can become.
-Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith

ROTS Council Respect thread S3I4U8D8VWaY6mARceu61xGHFlDttIYvuxQ8I2hmHx8hCLHUoLywaPGPo8IS02WcmvjBxCQiCN59nfeQYo_uAKldO-zC9oYfuUtjJZR1foEPy51UtR-s0AJcRlkyOdKBZ1QsYwJ8
-Star Wars: The Official Starships & Vehicles Collection 25

Cin Drallig is honored with the mantle of both Chief of Security and Battlemaster for the Jedi Temple. His unparalleled skill with a lightsaber has benefited many a Jedi under his tutelage, including Obi-Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker.
-Star Wars: The Force Collection  (Credit to WollfMyth209 )

While Ti seems inferior to Drallig in the context of Anakin’s assault on the Jedi Temple, and inferior to Mundi in the context of the battle on Hypori, both events are really going to screw with Ti’s emotional balance, and can’t be used to place her. 

Obi Wan Kenobi has a bunch of interesting things to say about Shaak Ti.

He seemingly believes that the idea of Anakin accomplishing what Stass Allie and Shaak Ti working together could not to be preposterous, and believes Ti to be the most cunning Jedi Knight he has ever met in a combative sense.


"Anakin, he was defended by Stass Allie and Shaak Ti. If two Masters could not prevent this, do you think you could? Stass Allie is clever and valiant, and Shaak Ti is the most cunning Jedi I've ever met. She's even taught me a few tricks."
Anakin assumed he was supposed to be impressed. "But General Grievous-"
"Master Ti had faced him before, Anakin. After Muunilinst. She is not only subtle and experienced, but very capable indeed. Seats on the Jedi Council aren't handed out as party favors."
-Obi Wan to Anakin, Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith

Obi Wan believes the combined might of Mace Windu and Shaak Ti is more than sufficient to subdue Darth Sidious, and expresses this belief to Anakin Skywalker. And Anakin doesn't disagree.


Anakin turned his back to Obi-Wan. His face was flushed when he finally swung around.
"Not good enough."
Obi-Wan blinked.
"Not good enough?"
"The search for Sidious began with us. We discovered the first clues. If he's thought to be on Coruscant, then we're the ones who should be there to capture him."
"Anakin, Mace and Shaak Ti are more than capable of seeing to that - - if Sidious is even there."Anakin was shaking his head.
"Not as easily as... we could. Sidious is a Sith Lord!"
-Star Wars: Labyrinth of Evil
Mace Windu also seems to highly respect Ti’s abilities.

Despite Shaak Ti’s emotional instability, Mace Windu believes Shaak Ti was the Jedi Master to have beside oneself in chaotic combative situations.


As beautiful as a flower, as deadly as a viper, Shaak Ti was the Jedi Master one wanted by one's side in chaotic circumstances. Graced with the ability to move quickly through crowds or tight spots, she was often the first to wade into close-quarter engagements, her striped montrals and lengthy head-tail alert to distances, her blue lightsaber quick to find its mark. She had proved instrumental in the defense of Kamino and Brentaal IV, and Mace was glad to have her with him now.
-Star Wars: Labyrinth of Evil

Even Anakin Skywalker seems to think quite highly of Shaak Ti.

I’m not really sure how to use this statement, but it’s definitely interesting.


"Exactly what lightsaber form were you using back there, Master?" Anakin asked when Obi-Wan had come around and the rebreathers were no longer necessary.
"Form?"
"More the absence of it." Anakin laughed shortly. "If only Mace, Kit, or Shaak Ti could have seen you."
-Star Wars: Labyrinth of Evil

While not necessarily indicative of anything on its own, Anakin’s primary concern when he arrives at the Jedi Temple is the location of Shaak Ti, whereas he seems unconcerned with the location of Cin Drallig. It’s an interesting implication to take into account alongside Ti’s general placement.


"Anakin!" he gasped, running up to the young man. "Anakin, what happened? Where are the Masters?"
Anakin looked at him as though he wasn't sure who the Gate Master was. "Where is Shaak Ti?"
"In the meditation chambers-we felt something happen in the Force, something awful. She's searching the Force in deep meditation, trying to get some feel for what's going on . . ." His words trailed away. Anakin didn't seem to be listening. "Something has happened, hasn't it?"
Jurokk looked past him now. The night beyond the Temple was full of clones. Battalions of them. Brigades. Thousands.
"Anakin," he said slowly, "what's going on? Something's happened. Something horrible. How bad is it-?"
The last thing Jurokk felt was the emitter of a lightsaber against the soft flesh beneath his jaw; the last thing he heard as blue plasma chewed upward through his head and burst from the top of his skull and burned away his life, was Anakin Skywalker's melancholy reply.
"You have no idea ..."
-Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith

Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 10:58 pm
Kit Fisto
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 10:58 pm
Ki Adi Mundi
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 10:59 pm
Saesee Tiin
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 10:59 pm
Agen Kolar
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 10:59 pm
Plo Koon
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 10:59 pm
Obi Wan
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 11:00 pm
Allie Stass
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 11:00 pm
Mace Windu
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 11:00 pm
Anakin
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 11:00 pm
Yoda
Reynard (Ethanion)
Reynard (Ethanion)

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on April 2nd 2020, 11:00 pm
Oppo Rancisis
Vader's Legacy
Vader's Legacy
Level Three
Level Three

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on April 3rd 2020, 12:39 am
Lmfao, good jokes here
The lord of hunger
The lord of hunger
Level One
Level One

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on April 3rd 2020, 12:59 am
Besides the dogshit nonsense of Vader being more powerful than Yoda and by the extensión of both being weaker than a Tpm Kenobi.... Everything else is good
The Lost
The Lost
Level Five
Level Five

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on April 3rd 2020, 1:01 am
Revolutionary thread. ROTS Council Respect thread 1143629744 ROTS Council Respect thread 1289255181
xolthol
xolthol
Champion of the Light
Champion of the Light

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on April 3rd 2020, 2:18 am
Extremly interresting blog
Vader's Legacy
Vader's Legacy
Level Three
Level Three

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on April 4th 2020, 11:13 pm
ILS wrote:Revolutionary thread. ROTS Council Respect thread 1143629744 ROTS Council Respect thread 1289255181

Do you actually think that this argument has any real concrete basis?
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