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Dooku vs. Maul Brothers - Page 3 Empty Re: Dooku vs. Maul Brothers

on October 5th 2019, 3:34 am
To Elm's points:
1. Let's grant that Dooku can beat Anakin and Obi-Wan from late TCW since connecting TCW to RotS SN that way would lead us in that direction. That doesn't really address Maul and Savage directly since Dooku does evidently perform differently vs different types of opponents in different situations. Not just Savage but Maul or to use a pertinent example, Vos, are all different variables to consider.

2. There is evidence strongly suggesting Mustafar Kenobi rose in power sharply.

3. Not aware of any reason to think late CW Dooku grew in power enough to make a difference. I don't even know if that's been mentioned anywhere. Dooku seems pretty maxed out potential wise by this point.

Anyway, main point: Savage is the main reason Dooku loses here. TCW Kenobi's Ataru or RotS Kenobi's Soresu is not comparable to Savage's attributes and style, not even close.

He "barely" held an edge over a less powerful Savage and Ventress who is just overall weaker than Maul. I also think Kenobi's Ataru (which Dooku knows inside and out from sparring endlessly with Yoda and Jinn, along with its weaknesses), or his Soresu (which is way too passive for Dooku's highly dueling oriented Makashi) is almost uniquely great style-wise for Dooku compared to Ventress, Maul, Anakin, Savage etc.

Dooku vs. Maul Brothers - Page 3 Empty Re: Dooku vs. Maul Brothers

on October 5th 2019, 10:09 am
Message reputation : 100% (2 votes)
Savage is not making any difference here unless he's in brainwash mode. Trying to isolate the single instance of Savage landing one inconclusive hit and saying that means he wins is ignorant and ignoring Savages later inconsistencies. Despite apparently "growing stronger", Savage fails to replicate this feat with Kenobi, despite him being mentally hindered at the time, he failed to replicate this again on Florrum with either Adi or Kenobi, he failed to replicate this with Plo Koon, he failed to replicate this against Ventress, despite coming down from 7 feet above with all his weight in a full hammer blow. This is the same Ventress that Dooku can casually manhandle handle with strength. As a far the "bare" edge goes

Asajj Ventress and Savage Opress wage a combined attack against Dooku, whose abilities with the Force far surpass those of his apprentices.

Not really. Dooku far surpasses their combined powers. But let's be kind and say the two contradictory sources cancel each other out, we look at the source material itself.

Dooku easily dodges both Savage and Ventress' attacks, even when deprived of his lightsaber. The one fluke hit Savage lands is instantly negated by the Counts powers, he dodged the rest and it's made abundantly clear that the duo were on the verge of losing before Savage snapped. 

At no point was Dooku "barely" doing anything. He had a timely and effective answer for everything they had even saberless, the only blow landed was Opress' one hit which he has never replicated even against weaker opponents after supposedly growing stronger. So that leaves us with

1. Savage could only perform this ability whilst in a Nightsister trance or the massive Dark Rage amp caused by breaking said trance, where he possessed singular focus and control.

2. Savage can perform this again. But simply never does. In which case it's about as useful as bringing up Koon's electric judgement or Maul knowing lightning. It's pointless if it's clear in character they will never use it.

Once again, Dooku wins. He could, not once, but twice gain breathing room against Obi-Wan and Anakin via physical strikes and force attack, as our great friend ILS has said in this thread

ILS wrote:Styles make fights.

Maul's juyo leaves him vulnerable to counters the Count is more than happy to provide. Likewise if even Plo Koon can evade one of Savage's attacks and land a saber strike, Oppress is losing a limb here almost instantly. 

I mean hell, Kenobi was able to push the brothers back for a time in order to get an opening for escape and a weapon retrieval. 
Dooku vs. Maul Brothers - Page 3 Giphy
And likewise despite being stuck in a confined space between the two brothers was able evade all of their coordinated attacks while hitting Savage with impunity.

Dooku is more than capable of pulling that off.
Dooku vs. Maul Brothers - Page 3 5816689-2023520061-54935
So no. Savage is not making any difference here. And Maul just loses.

Dooku wins.
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Dooku vs. Maul Brothers - Page 3 Empty Re: Dooku vs. Maul Brothers

on October 5th 2019, 2:06 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
Good post Grey.

OT-The Count.
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Dooku vs. Maul Brothers - Page 3 Empty Re: Dooku vs. Maul Brothers

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