Darth Plagueis vs. SWTOR Vitiate

The Ellimist wrote:

DarthSkywalker0 wrote:

• Along with Sidious (who wasn't as powerful as him yet), unbalanced the entire cosmic Force to a massive degree by meditating on an island for a few months, creating a titanic paradigm shift that would lead to the fogging of the long-term foresight of the Jedi and the ability to do more midichlorian manipulation (massively pre-prime)
  
  
• Attempted to TP every living being in the galaxy and create a godlike Force user, implied to only fail because the Force itself actively intervened; the Force ended up seeing him and Sidious as big enough threats to create the Chosen One to stop them (pre-prime)
  
  
• Vaporized a half dozen armored assassins with uncharged telekinesis while severely injured (pre-prime)
  
  
• Replicated the effects of sith sorcery using sheer willpower/midichlorian manipulation (pre-prime)
  
  
• Used midichlorian manipulation to tank at point-blank range Darth Sidious's lightning (to which he was drawing more deeply in the dark side than he ever had) without using any other Force barrier, only dying because his breathing apparatus broke
  
  

Can you quantify the power that all of these abilities would require or why Vitiate would not be able to replicate any of them? 

His best feat, Ziost, involves draining billions across a planet. Do billions outweigh the entire cosmic Force? There's a reason why Plagueis and Sidious were Chosen One-tier threats.

Do billions outweigh the cosmic force? Does the logic apply to Caedus? Would Vitiate not be a Chosen One threat if the Father was dying?

I feel going off the "do billions outweigh the entire cosmic Force" logic can be used to put basically anyone you want below Palpatine/Plagueis.

DarthSkywalker0 wrote:Do billions outweigh the cosmic force?

Seeing as how the cosmic Force is a universal presence that influences the course of far more than a single planet, I doubt it.

Does the logic apply to Caedus?

Caedus didn't wrest the balance of the Force through a raw exertion of power.

Would Vitiate not be a Chosen One threat if the Father was dying?

Uncertain. Presumably the threat here is Plagueis creating an Anakin-tier being; the closest to that for Vitiate would be his galaxy ritual, which would've been done with far more external support than Plagueis's midichlorian manipulation.

Seeing as how the cosmic Force is a universal presence that influences the course of far more than a single planet, I doubt it.

I am not disagreeing with you just asking for more detail. We know the force could have stopped Plagy(Plagy notes it could boil their midiclorians) + Plagy also states he does not comprehend the will of the force.  So, how do we precisely quantify this exertion?

Caedus didn't wrest the balance of the Force through a raw exertion of power.

How do you know? Also, we know from FOTJ the current wasn't changed so this force clearly allowed this to happen, not so sure with Caedus. 

DarthSkywalker0 wrote:I am not disagreeing with you just asking for more detail. We know the force could have stopped Plagy(Plagy notes it could boil their midiclorians) + Plagy also states he does not comprehend the will of the force.  So, how do we precisely quantify this exertion?

One way to quantify it is to note that no other dark sider on record managed to pull off such a thing, even though 1) it was described as a matter of exertion in the Force rather than an esoteric technique, and 2) it carried immense benefits for Plagueis and Sidious (at least ignoring the Force's ultimate retaliation). You could say that the Father was dying, but the Force hadn't been noted to be particularly unbalanced.

How do you know? Also, we know from FOTJ the current wasnt changed so this force clearly allowed this to happen, not so sure with Caedus. 

I suppose you can't know that he didn't do that, but there's no reason to think that he did.

One way to quantify it is to note that no other dark sider on record managed to pull off such a thing, even though 1) it was described as a matter of exertion in the Force rather than an esoteric technique, and 2) it carried immense benefits for Plagueis and Sidious (at least ignoring the Force's ultimate retaliation). You could say that the Father was dying, but the Force hadn't been noted to be particularly unbalanced.

But, how can we compare this feat to Ziost, if the energy required is unclear(even if we know it is an impressive amount)? 

I suppose you can't know that he didn't do that, but there's no reason to think that he did.

Thanks for clarification. 

My answer to the quesiton: I have no clue. I don't see any good way to compare their feats and no quotes juxtapose them.

The Ellimist wrote:
His best feat, Ziost, involves draining billions across a planet.

Source for billions?

Just been wondering. Both are confirmed to be weaker than Sidious, both are incredibly intelligent, both have a wide array of powers, etc.

Which iteration of Vitiate?

prime. prime for both. before he became valkorion tho

Vitiate then.

Merged the threads.

Plagueis wins. Even if Vitiate is comparably powerful, he's an infinitely shittier combatant.

Plagueis is subtler, but stronger. He stomps in a lightsaber duel.