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Zenwolf
Zenwolf
Level One
Level One

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

November 29th 2020, 3:50 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
So this honestly has been a long time coming for me to try and work out in hopefully to get across the point, so going to try finally. So as everyone knows TCW(08) was put into Legends Canon as it's own bracket of Canon otherwise known as T-Canon.

Now technically yes it is apart of Legends Canon, but it's not really. Or at the least it isn't apart of the overall Canon(C-Canon) that was put into place prior to 08. So I'm going to go over 2 points here as to why one shouldn't try to mesh TCW(08) with the rest of C-Canon...which is what I see a lot of people do. Now this DOESN'T mean C-Canon is ENTIRELY off the table to use...I'll get into that after the two points.


1. It makes NO SENSE

That's basically it in a nutshell, TCW(08) makes literally no sense to pretty much ANY prior C-Canon published material. Characters are different either appearance wise from how they should be within the timeline(compared to how they look before) or are completely different personality or how they operate. Or they don't even appear AT ALL. Or these new characters are put in that doesn't add up to the prior C-Canon material or even return.

The most glaring of examples of big changes being General Grievous and Aurra Sing.

The first....I mean come on, how are people seeing Grievous 03 and coming to the conclusion that the 08 is the same. They aren't...at all and it's not just visuals either, it's personality and how they operate.

Sing again another great example, in TCW(08) we see that she's pretty much just a bounty hunter, there isn't any mention of her being a former Jedi Padawan or having Jedi training at all.

Yet still whenever these two are brought up in a battle, people still reference TCW(08) and whatever C-Canon material and I'm just sitting here going "...why??" What because Grievous constantly fights Obi-Wan and that somehow makes him a better combatant despite the fact that you don't really need to see them fight for the hundredth time?

Sing I really don't understand, because I'm pretty sure whatever she does in TCW(08), she can do even better when she's actually a formerly trained Jedi and actually having The Force and a lightsaber.

Durge is another HUGE one because he doesn't even appear at all. Despite the fact he was active throughout the Clone Wars against the Republic. Yeah I'm sure missing one of the CIS' Commanders is a big ? mark.

Ahsoka and Maul....yeah I don't think I need to explain why they throw a large bag of monkey wrenches into everything.

Then there's the fact that the Nightsisters are all Dark Force Users, when that wasn't the case in C-Canon, they were more diverse, hell even the planet Dathomir is completely different too.

Anakin wasn't Commander/General of the 501st Legion and was pretty much by Obi-Wan's side throughout the entire war with the 212th Attack Battalion. The 501st went through more than 1 General and their  Commander was Appo, not Rex.

I'm sure there's more, but let's just move onto point 2.

2. The C-Canon Timeline is already complete

Kind of going off point 1, but this is basically why nothing in TCW(08) makes sense with anything prior 08 CW material. The timeline for C-Canon is already completed up to ROTS within the Microseries CW Anakin and Obi-Wan making their way back to Coruscant as Grievous was attacking it. Then adding in the various novels, games and so forth which compliment all of this into a completed timeline.

TCW(08) is basically a separate timeline within Legends, this makes sense since...well nothing seems to coincide with what is noted and new characters appearing or old ones changed or not appearing at all. The 08 series completely started a new slate with which to work off of...you could perhaps think of it like what Disney did to the post-ROTJ EU, where they wiped the slate clean to make the ST. People don't really seem to think about this a whole lot, but it'll save one a bunch of headaches with trying to all figure it out...like trying to mix and match a puzzle piece that just isn't going to work.



But let's move onto where you can use C-Canon(TCW Exception) with TCW.

C-Canon(TCW Exception)

So C-Canon as we all know just basically stands for Continuity and that in a nutshell is basically something that is continued over a period of time. Now TCW can be used in C-Canon(TCW Exception), this however would be a bit more limited. If you folks notice that, various books and such are all revolved around TCW(this again another added point in that it's a separate timeline). Example those TCW comics or the novels such as TCW: Wild Space.

Now these can be used as a Continuity Canon for the TCW(08) show, that as far as I have seen can be fine because there isn't any huge glaring issues. Same with the Sourcebooks such as The Clone Wars Campaign Guide although for such as these, it would have to be used carefully using S-Canon IE: Ignore what isn't correct and vice versa. Example the Clone Assassins are in there, yet they make no appearance whatsoever in TCW.

Oh here's a better way of looking at it. TCW is the foundation(much like the OT/PT for C-Canon EU) where the supplement TCW material(novels, comics etc) can be used.

So there it is folks, I've hoped I've explained it well enough, trying my best. But yeah, I just had this in the back of my mind and I figured it was finally time to put it forward here before I just lost interest or forgot about it.

Now this isn't to say one can't, I mean I certainly can't force anyone to do this. Just to me, I don't really understand the point of trying to put the two together when...to me it just doesn't add up and it's not even the timeline or characters, but also feats, cause you can tell that TCW is more grounded compared to elsewhere and it's rather jarring honestly.

But you guys do you, if you folks can somehow make it seem like it all works together more power to you.


Last edited by Zenwolf on December 24th 2020, 1:16 pm; edited 4 times in total
lorenzo.r.2nd
lorenzo.r.2nd
Level Three
Level Three

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

November 29th 2020, 4:03 pm
"Ok think of it like this, a giant tree(SW movies) and the branches being the other media(EU novels, comics, games etc)."
...sounds like the movies are still coming first lol
Zenwolf
Zenwolf
Level One
Level One

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 24th 2020, 1:15 pm
BUMP! Alright instead of making an entirely new thread, I just edited an old one of mine. So hopefully it now will make more sense.
CuckedCurry
CuckedCurry
Level Four
Level Four

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 24th 2020, 1:40 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
They can’t effectively co-exist. Like if you try to force them then you have to abandon the Quinlan Vos rep comics storyline as Bulq remains a Jedi during the TCW series. You have to abandon a load of scaling chains as most of the characters are pale imitations combatively. You have to abandon Obsession as Ventress’ injuries in that series are a result of their battle on Coruscant during Dreadnaughts of Rendili + the DD retcon. It’s one continuity or the other tbh
Zenwolf
Zenwolf
Level One
Level One

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 24th 2020, 1:53 pm
@CuckedCurry wrote:They can’t effectively co-exist. Like if you try to force them then you have to abandon the Quinlan Vos rep comics storyline as Bulq remains a Jedi during the TCW series. You have to abandon a load of scaling chains as most of the characters are pale imitations combatively. You have to abandon Obsession as Ventress’ injuries in that series are a result of their battle on Coruscant during Dreadnaughts of Rendili + the DD retcon. It’s one continuity or the other tbh

I mean yes, that would be the logical path to take. Just treat TCW as Disney Canon, but seeing as I know many won't want to do that, this would be another way to look at it rather than trying to make sense of putting all of it together. In a nutshell TCW(08) + C-Canon(TCW Exception) material. Done.
TheNuisanceBird
TheNuisanceBird

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 24th 2020, 9:15 pm
It really irritates me how so many people don't know the original multimedia project exists and just say TCW is better when it objectively isn't.
Zenwolf
Zenwolf
Level One
Level One

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 24th 2020, 9:38 pm
@TheNuisanceBird wrote:It really irritates me how so many people don't know the original multimedia project exists and just say TCW is better when it objectively isn't.

It's cause TCW is more readily available IE: It's on TV pretty much, whereas the CWMM was in novels, comics, games etc which is harder for the casual fan to get into. But yeah, I agree to that.
Nute_Chethray
Nute_Chethray
Moderator
Moderator

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 25th 2020, 11:21 am
Definetly agree. Personally I therefore seperate the two in debates unless its unavoidable (for example in an SS where the opponent doesn't follow the same logic)
Zenwolf
Zenwolf
Level One
Level One

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

December 25th 2020, 11:37 am
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
@Nute_Chethray wrote:Definetly agree. Personally I therefore seperate the two in debates unless its unavoidable (for example in an SS where the opponent doesn't follow the same logic)

I mean I think it's sound logic, less headaches in trying to rationalize why a character is so different, I mean granted pre-TCW wasn't perfect, but I feel it was consistent in setting up a flowing timeline up from the start of the CW to the beginning of ROTS. Trying to shove TCW in there....it's like trying to shove a square block into a marble sized hole...not gonna work.
TheNuisanceBird
TheNuisanceBird

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

January 2nd 2021, 6:50 pm
Especially with the context of it being 2008 where they could've done a Vader show. The gap between ROTS-ANH was unexplored at that time and there were books, comics, and video games, being released during that time set in that area so it would've made sense to have a CGI Vader show detailing Anakin getting used to the suit and the fucked up shit he did during that time. Also Legends wasn't a thing yet so at the time TCW was a massive offender in continuity which they wouldn't have to worry about with Vader.

Captain Fordo (YouTuber) did a video on how he would've written TCW to fit in with the established timeline and I pretty much agree with everything he says there.
VictreebelVictr
VictreebelVictr

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

January 2nd 2021, 7:22 pm
Grand job Zen. TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). 1289255181
Zenwolf
Zenwolf
Level One
Level One

TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). Empty Re: TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon).

January 2nd 2021, 8:08 pm
@VictreebelVictr wrote:Grand job Zen. TCW(08) and Legends(C-Canon). 1289255181

Thanks and again if you guys can somehow work this into making any sort of sense....well...go for it. But to me, it just doesn't add up. I mean even speaking from a battle perspective, I don't think much is really lost. Or at least that's what it seemed like to me.
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