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Latham2000
Latham2000
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What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Empty What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine?

on March 30th 2020, 4:06 pm
The question is about the nature of Vader's training, specifically about what knowledge, techniques and secrets did Palpatine share with Vader that is usuable in combat, lightsaber and Force related. Please cite your sources.
The lord of hunger
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on March 30th 2020, 5:05 pm
The excerpts from the journal of Darth Malgus kept during the Great Galactic War some thirty-six centuries ago are a prime example of how a wounded warrior can be sustained by rage. The war was an unbounded success for the era's Sith Emperor, and Malgus was one of his best soldiers. I obtained this text many decades ago from a dealer in antiquities, and have recently passed it to Darth Vader so he might gain inspiration.
-- Book Of Sith: Secrets From The Dark Side
CuckedCurry
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on March 30th 2020, 6:01 pm
Not a lot. Vader notes in Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader that Palpatine only have him snippets of knowledge—enough to cause slight increases in power, but not enough to ever pose a threat to Wankatine.
Latham2000
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on March 30th 2020, 6:15 pm
I would like to know more about Vader's knowledge of lightsaber forms and weapons, if Palpatine shared any with him because he knows pretty much everything.
The lord of hunger
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on March 30th 2020, 6:40 pm
Luke is, perhaps, learning more about the Dark Side than he wants to know. The more the Emperor reveals, the more Luke is repulsed. The sheer depravity of the man would shake the soul of the strongest Jedi.
But Luke must continually remind himself of his vow to conquer the Dark Side from within.
Luke's father understood these secrets, these powers, and willingly used them to crush and enslave multitudes of Galactic citizens.
"Your father knew the Dark Side well...especially my teachings of weakness. How he could inspire fear! Yes...you have that talent...you are a Skywalker after all... You can be like him... You can be greater than he was!"
--
Satisfied that his "young apprentice" has crossed the threshold from which there is no returning, the Emperor unveils his teaching, and Luke is given the knowledge that was bestowed on his father before him!
-- Dark Empire Endnotes
Master Azronger
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What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Empty Re: What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine?

on March 30th 2020, 7:33 pm
@Latham2000 wrote:I would like to know more about Vader's knowledge of lightsaber forms and weapons, if Palpatine shared any with him because he knows pretty much everything.

Even in 19 BBY, Vader's a high-end master of all lightsaber styles per DLTRODV.

_________________
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Sheev_sig_3
The Lost
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on March 30th 2020, 8:04 pm
Message reputation : 100% (2 votes)
Sedriss was compared to Sidious' apprentices as a "moderate Force sensitive" and a "capable errand boy" but "hardly the stuff of a Sith apprentice."
“As leader of my Dark Side Adepts, Military Executor Sedriss has been the most loyal, and is commended for reviving me here on Byss. But for all his usefulness, Sedriss is only a moderate Force-sensitive, a capable errand boy but hardly the stuff of a Sith apprentice.”

―Darth Sidious, Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force

Yet Sedriss "underwent extensive training" to "wield power the way the Emperor himself did."
Sedriss underwent extensive training under the Emperor, learning to develop his Force talents to wield power the way the Emperor himself did.

―Dark Side Sourcebook

He received superior training to the likes of Ventress, Mara Jade, the Inquisitors or the Shadow Guard. I am guessing this would extend to the various Dark Jedi Adepts Sidious had in his employ as well.
In that particular instance, Bane and Sidious were foiled, but Sidious' basic aims remained. He sought to create a network of Force-wielding agents loyal only to him. None would be trained sufficiently to be a threat to Darth Bane's insistence that there only be two Sith, nor would they be a threat to Darth Sidious or his apprentice, Darth Vader. The most powerful of these agents were "only" Sith adepts but would appear almost as dark Jedi - the likes of Asajj Ventress, Mara Jade, or Inquisitor Valin Draco (in fact, a fallen Jedi). The lesser agents were reduced to still-deadly faceless minions. Among their ranks were the Shadow Guard.

―The Official Starships And Vehicles Collection 63

He had unlimited access to the Jedi archives.
Black armorweave and feats of strength weren't the only things that distinguished Darth Vader from Anakin Skywalker. Where Anakin had had limited access to the Jedi Temple data room, Vader–even light-years from Coruscant–could peruse any data he wished, including archival records, ancient texts, and holocrons fashioned by past Masters.

―Dark Lord: The Rise Of Darth Vader

And he also studied the dark side on his own.
On Vjun, Vader conducted his own studies of the dark side. He had no doubt that the Emperor knew what he wanted more than anything: the power to kill his Master.

―The Rise And Fall Of Darth Vader

As Darth Sidious's apprentice, Vader continues to expand his knowledge and the power of the dark side.

―Force And Destiny Core Rulebook

Then if we look at what Dark Empire has to say about it...

Sidious wanted to push Luke "deep into the seductive embrace of the Dark Side."
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? KEK8VXy

Luke "learned his lessons well."
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? XzsM11C

He appears to have learned "The Emperor's Darkest Secrets...", Sidious "unveils his teaching" and Luke is "given the knowledge that was bestowed on his father before him."
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? VwZS4nI

"Luke's father understood these secrets, these powers" [...] "Your father knew the Dark Side well... especially my teachings of weakness."
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Fo0AjbM

Luke is "using the powers" Sidious gave him and "learned many of [Sheev's] secrets."
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? KXRdL0k

Luke learned "all the dark things [Vader] knew so well"
What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? DviYTKu

Luke has also read the Dark Side Compendium and/or Book of Sith (don't have the scan on-hand for this one). So I guess that would include the Books of Anger, Weakness and Creation of Monsters/Manipulation of Life, Sorzus, Malgus, Bane, Talzin and Plagueis' stuff.

"Listen to me, Leia...we can stop him...I've read his dark books. According to his own words, he has awakened a chaos even he cannot control!
―Luke (Dark Empire)

Just off the top of my head, I believe Sidious recovered Ramage's holocron post-RotS, which had some wild shit in it. Sidious also has the Blackguard going to the ends of the galaxy to gather knowledge for him. And seeing as Vader was no less well trained than Maul or Dooku, was Sidious' favourite "monster", a "minor masterpiece", and had more time and resources than either to train with, not to mention the added benefit of training Galen Marek (another catalyst for growth is training an apprentice), you can basically copy and paste the "Force Knowledge" sections of the various Maul, Dooku and Banite Sith threads/essays out there and apply them to Vader. Maul is already one of or, depending on the accolade, the, best trained Sith ever by TPM, and his appearance in TPM is evidence that the Sith have returned "deadlier" or "better" than ever, with the Banite Sith being said to have studied "all aspects" of the Force and to have "evolved" over the last 1,000 years, and Dooku has a mountain of immense knowledge accolades before being introduced to "realms of power beyond his most spectacular fantasies" by Sidious.

He's easily one of the best trained Sith ever, probably top 10 at least.
lorenzo.r.2nd
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What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Empty Re: What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine?

on March 30th 2020, 8:09 pm
u can tell how much scorn ILS has for vader in his above essay covering the dickless man.
The Lost
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on March 30th 2020, 8:18 pm
Message reputation : 100% (4 votes)
It's a well known fact that becoming a eunuch leads to many abilities some would consider to be unnatural.
The lord of hunger
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What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Empty Re: What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine?

on March 30th 2020, 9:23 pm
This make me realize that Vader is quite haxxed on his power level once more.
lorenzo.r.2nd
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What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Empty Re: What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine?

on March 30th 2020, 10:21 pm
ILS wrote:It's a well known fact that becoming a eunuch leads to many abilities some would consider to be unnatural.
anybody that has read DE knows this
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What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine? Empty Re: What kind of Sith training did suited Darth Vader receive from Palpatine?

on March 30th 2020, 11:46 pm
Yet all this stuff for Vader, people still lowball him for some reason or another.
The lord of hunger
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on March 31st 2020, 12:18 am
@Zenwolf wrote:Yet all this stuff for Vader, people still lowball him for some reason or another.
Honestly what can you expect from the site by this point?  its common for some people to still downplay the character since he represents a serious thread to the SWTOR era (the principal theme the site wanks)
The Lost
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on March 31st 2020, 4:19 am
I think until a top tier debater takes up the reigns for Vader he's going to continue to be treated like a meme. That's basically how SW debating works at this point.
SithSauce
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on March 31st 2020, 4:33 am
Gillard implied Vader could be a tier 9 in an email
HellfireUnit
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on March 31st 2020, 4:43 am
@SithSauce wrote:Gillard implied Vader could be a tier 9 in an email

and why would Gillard's opinion on suit Vader matters? Gillard specifically worked with the production of PT, he has no authority over OT. Besides what timeline would it refer? I doubt Roan Shryne is also a tier 9 in sabers.
SithSauce
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on March 31st 2020, 4:54 am
@HellfireUnit wrote:
@SithSauce wrote:Gillard implied Vader could be a tier 9 in an email

and why would Gillard's opinion on suit Vader matters? Gillard specifically worked with the production of PT, he has no authority over OT. Besides what timeline would it refer? I doubt Roan Shryne is also a tier 9 in sabers.

Just his opinion dude
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on March 31st 2020, 6:39 am
Just because people don't have Vader with Dooku doesn't mean he's being lowballed lmao.
Latham2000
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on March 31st 2020, 6:53 am
@SithSauce wrote:Gillard implied Vader could be a tier 9 in an email

Gillard has no authority over OT era characters, and which version of Vader was he talking about? Pre-suit or suited?
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on March 31st 2020, 7:26 am
@Latham2000 wrote:
@SithSauce wrote:Gillard implied Vader could be a tier 9 in an email

Gillard has no authority over OT era characters, and which version of Vader was he talking about? Pre-suit or suited?
Suited
Latham2000
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on March 31st 2020, 8:59 am
@SithSauce wrote:
@Latham2000 wrote:
@SithSauce wrote:Gillard implied Vader could be a tier 9 in an email

Gillard has no authority over OT era characters, and which version of Vader was he talking about? Pre-suit or suited?
Suited

Show us the email.
SithSauce
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on March 31st 2020, 9:02 am
I'll DM you
Latham2000
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on March 31st 2020, 9:18 am
@SithSauce wrote:I'll DM you

Yeah I just read it, the questioner asks "Did you and Lucas ever decide what tier to put suited Vader on, or do you have your own personal opinion?" and Gillard's response "MY OPINION IS A DRUG ADDICT IS ALWAYS A DRUG ADDICT. Stay safe" i.e. Gillard explicitly states in his own opinion that hasn't been approved of by Lucas, that Vader is always a drug addict and suited Vader is a tier 9 fighter. Even if we take Gillard's self confessed opinion with the same merit as his non-opinion statements, you can't ignore that Gillard says that Anakin/Vader doesn't mentally become a level/tier 9 fighter, only physically because he went there too quickly and lacks the mental discipline of fighting, as the same Gillard likens it to taking a Force LSD, whereas Yoda and Sidious are conventional level/tier fighters, Mace is more of a grey area. So at best, suited Vader is physically a level 9 fighter, which puts him above all the normal level 8 fighters, but is inferior to Yoda and Sidious, though how he stacks up to Mace is up for debate.
lorenzo.r.2nd
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on March 31st 2020, 10:41 am
i doubt anyone hates the gillard system more than me, but him saying that a druggy will always be a druggy implies that he is comparable to before aka better or just as good as sidious and yoda, and not 'likely below' lol
lorenzo.r.2nd
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on March 31st 2020, 10:42 am
it would be nice of u two to share that shit tho lol
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