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LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Suspect Hero | Level Four
Suspect Hero | Level Four

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 8:23 pm
YVH Cilghal wrote:
@LadyKulvax wrote:So can someone give an argument as to why Luke is especially effective here? I mean, why? He's super fast or can TK you to a chair? That's cute and all, bit I'm pretty sure rendering everything around you completely immobile and thus defenseless, is more effective.
Well Luke can do this: 

Luke killed the last of Raynar's bodyguards by Force-slamming them into the wall so hard their thoraxes burst
[size=33]Dark Nest III: Swarm War[/size]
[size=33]I mean he did literally one-shot UnuThul’s bodyguards  ( I don’t remember whether or not they were force sensitive or not), I think he could do the same to Malgus, especially considering how he’s going to go all-out in this scenario. [/size]
In what way are bodyguards comparable to Darth Malgus who was tanking fatal wounds decades before his vastly superior incarnations in the game. Especially Post-KOTET given his immensely improved armor and durability.

He survived being inside a space station as it exploded, which could destroy shielded capital ships within a two kilometre radius. That's prior to the aforementioned improvents after KOTET.
MasterCilghal
MasterCilghal
Level Three
Level Three

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 8:30 pm
@LadyKulvax no, they aren’t. But a force push, or force grip, from a Luke who is willing to go all out should be more than enough to take down Malgus. The only reason Luke didn’t one-shot people like UnuThul was because of his fear of abusing his power. But in this thread, it doesn’t apply. 
He can just do this, but he doesn’t give Malgus the option of surrendering: 


The Master sighed and shook his head. "What am I going to do with you, Raynar Thul?" he asked. "You learn nothing from your mistakes."
Luke deactivated his lightsaber and picked Raynar up by the collar and slammed him against the wall. He used the Force to pin him there, waiting for an answer to his question, watching as the expression in his captive's pained eyes turned from astonishment to anger to calculation.
-The swarm war 
It’s equally as effective as what Valkorion can do, if not more.
KingofBlades
KingofBlades
Level Three
Level Three

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 8:31 pm
@LadyKulvax
Lmao Luke snaps Malgus's neck via TK. Or he speedblitzes him with his lightsaber. Or he instakills him with lightning. Or he puts him in a force stasis, then walks up and stabs him. Luke isn't lacking in ways to end this fight instantly
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Suspect Hero | Level Four
Suspect Hero | Level Four

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 9:32 pm
YVH Cilghal wrote:@LadyKulvax no, they aren’t. But a force push, or force grip, from a Luke who is willing to go all out should be more than enough to take down Malgus. The only reason Luke didn’t one-shot people like UnuThul was because of his fear of abusing his power. But in this thread, it doesn’t apply. 
He can just do this, but he doesn’t give Malgus the option of surrendering: 


The Master sighed and shook his head. "What am I going to do with you, Raynar Thul?" he asked. "You learn nothing from your mistakes."
Luke deactivated his lightsaber and picked Raynar up by the collar and slammed him against the wall. He used the Force to pin him there, waiting for an answer to his question, watching as the expression in his captive's pained eyes turned from astonishment to anger to calculation.
-The swarm war 
It’s equally as effective as what Valkorion can do, if not more.
How is that as effective as freezing the entire environment? He's effectively stopping time, LMFAO. He could easily replicate such TK.
KingofBlades
KingofBlades
Level Three
Level Three

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 9:52 pm
Is the malgus pretense of this debate really necessary? It seems to be only complicating things. Like rn ladykulvax is debating whether Valkorion's time hax would be better suited to killing Malgus than Luke blitzing him instead of arguing if Valkorion(character X) is actually more powerful than Luke(character y) or if Valkorion would beat Luke in a fight, which I think is closer to the point of this tournament. Just throwing my two cents on improvements that could be made
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Suspect Hero | Level Four
Suspect Hero | Level Four

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 9:56 pm
That's exactly what we had last time and that worked a treat with the PT spammers. This absolutely should not be debated on the basis of vote-spamming.
KingofBlades
KingofBlades
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 10:06 pm
@LadyKulvax wrote:That's exactly what we had last time and that worked a treat with the PT spammers. This absolutely should not be debated on the basis of vote-spamming.
I fail to see how adding the whole malgus measuring bar eliminates vote spamming
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 10:07 pm
Because it partially prevents cross-era bias arguments.
Blade_of_Dorin
Blade_of_Dorin
Level One
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 2nd 2019, 10:19 pm
I’m with @KingofBlades tbh.
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Quorian Debatist
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 8:56 am
@dark_globe wrote:
@DarthAnt66 wrote:
@dark_globe wrote:GM luke
although his morals may not allow him to one shot malgus right away .
so if we are voting who would kill him faster than  prime sidious .

Note the stipulations hold that "while everyone will fight in-character, they will be aiming to kill Malgus as quickly and efficiently as possible with nothing held back."
well there is a bit of a cotradiction than because luke fighting "in-character"
would not go for insta kill right away because of his jedi morals .
i´m sticking with prime sidious : this dude has no problem to blitz or insta kill his opponents if he is 100% serious and he has zero morals unlike luke .

Luke has probably been vividly described to brutally kill more beings face to face than anyone who would make this list. Some of the most brutal kills in Star Wars are from Luke. The only times he doesn't is when he was younger or has some connection with the opposition. Even then you have cases like him catching Lumiya from falling to her death just so he could decapitate her.

Malgus is just a Sith to him and he has no reason not to cut him in half. Rhea for example got her arm and leg cut off, and then got beheaded by him.

As for how fast Luke can kill Malgus; I can't imagine force pulling him into a lightsaber wouldn't be top 3 of the swiftest kills possible. Here he does it to an Abeloth avatar for example before he even activated his faux-oneness:

Apocalypse wrote:But on the near side of the stack-head, Jaina was done. She was on her knees, swaying in exhaustion and dangerously close to falling unconscious. Luke used the Force to pull her a safe distance away from the pit's edge, then turned to find his own trouble almost on him. With the first rank of Sith only two steps from the other side of the stack-head, he tossed his blaster behind him and extended a hand, grabbing four Sith ankles in a crushing Force grasp. He pulled them toward the pit.

Three of the Sith found themselves suddenly falling into the stack-head. They screamed and twisted, desperately searching for something they could grab-then plummeted out of sight. The fourth Sith managed to Force hurl himself backward and land on his side of the pit. Before Luke could drag him forward, a glass parang left the scabbard hanging from the man's belt and came flying.

Luke redirected the parang with little more than a thought, but by then Korelei and another Keshiri were in the air over the stack-head, their lightsabers ignited and their eyes fixed on Luke. He lit his own weapon and sprang to his feet, at the same time hitting them both with a Force blast that sent the male Keshiri tumbling back across the pit.

Korelei did not even feel it. She merely swung her lightsaber down to block Luke's slash, then planted a stomp kick square in his chest and sent him sailing down the duct backward.

Luke came down five meters away, a crushing pain in his chest. He struggled to draw breath. Korelei was barely two paces away, her fingers already glowing blue with the Force lightning she was about to hurl. With neither the time nor the strength to leap up, Luke merely reached for her in the Force, then turned his lightsaber toward her midsection and pulled.

They came together in a collision that left Luke's head spinning and his bones aching. He knew his lightsaber had struck home because he smelled scorched flesh. The hilt was wobbling against his hand as Korelei struggled to free herself of the searing blade. He felt a palm press itself to his chest, so he brought his free hand up and grabbed her arm... too late. His entire body sizzled into the joint-crushing grip of a Force lightning strike.


Basically, if he can force pull Abeloth who just tanked a force push, he can rip Malgus to him nigh-instantly to bisect him. Not saying others can't too, but this is a direct tactic he used specifically. 

With that said, Nyax would consistently maul Malgus in seconds as well. With Luke it'd have to be a specific tactic, but with Nyax it's the first thing he'd do everytime. With his speed, power, ferocity and EIGHT SABERS, there's really not much chance for Malgus lasting any amount of time. While I don't think Nyax is above Crucible Luke, it'd be like unleashing a furious Jack Russell on a rat. 

So, Nyax has my vote.
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Suspect Hero | Level Four
Suspect Hero | Level Four

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 9:03 am
Still not seeing any kind of genuine, convincing argument that beats literally making Malgus incapable of reacting in any way or form and insta-killing him.
MasterCilghal
MasterCilghal
Level Three
Level Three

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 11:11 am
@Quorian debatist wrote:Rhea for example got her arm and leg cut off, and then got beheaded by him.
Always good to see someone talking about Rhea. 
However, don’t forget that against her specifically decided to cut her in half because he wasn’t in the right shape to be merciful, he was exhausted and injured. It’s specifically said in the book. He wouldn’t have done otherwise under normal circumstances.


Last edited by YVH Cilghal on August 3rd 2019, 11:17 am; edited 1 time in total
HellfireUnit
HellfireUnit
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Level Six

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 11:14 am
Luke.
CuckedCurry
CuckedCurry
Level Four
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 11:27 am
Luke probably
KingofBlades
KingofBlades
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 12:27 pm
@LadyKulvax wrote:Still not seeing any kind of genuine, convincing argument that beats literally making Malgus incapable of reacting in any way or form and insta-killing him.
Putting Malgus in force stasis would be just as effective
The Fallen Warrior
The Fallen Warrior
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 12:34 pm
Luke then.
XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 5:53 pm
I will vote for Luke in this round, but does anyone have a specific calculus for why Luke is above somebody like Valkorion? Is there a feat Luke has performed or scaling Luke possesses that is outside of Valkorion's range?
Master Azronger
Master Azronger
Moderator | Champion of the Light
Moderator | Champion of the Light

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 7:15 pm
@XSUPREMEXSKILLZ wrote:I will vote for Luke in this round, but does anyone have a specific calculus for why Luke is above somebody like Valkorion? Is there a feat Luke has performed or scaling Luke possesses that is outside of Valkorion's range?

How do you even determine "Valkorion's range" if you don't buy he's beneath DE Sheev?
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 9:21 pm
@KingofBlades wrote:
@LadyKulvax wrote:Still not seeing any kind of genuine, convincing argument that beats literally making Malgus incapable of reacting in any way or form and insta-killing him.
Putting Malgus in force stasis would be just as effective
But that's not the same thing as stopping time.
KingofBlades
KingofBlades
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 11:19 pm
@LadyKulvax wrote:
@KingofBlades wrote:
@LadyKulvax wrote:Still not seeing any kind of genuine, convincing argument that beats literally making Malgus incapable of reacting in any way or form and insta-killing him.
Putting Malgus in force stasis would be just as effective
But that's not the same thing as stopping time.
What makes stopping time more effective? Both result in malgus being completely unable to move.
Deronn_Solo
Deronn_Solo

★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 3rd 2019, 11:37 pm
Luke.
SithSauce
SithSauce
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 4th 2019, 3:03 am
Luke is the best bet
Master Azronger
Master Azronger
Moderator | Champion of the Light
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 4th 2019, 4:07 am
@Deronn_Solo Welcome to the forum.

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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Sheev_sig_3
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 4th 2019, 9:07 am
My vote goes to Lord Nyax.
DoA
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★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker - Page 3 Empty Re: ★ Top Fifteen Tournament #1 - Luke Skywalker

August 4th 2019, 9:51 am
Luke.
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