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The Slick Obi
The Slick Obi

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 1st 2020, 6:14 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
I have seen a good deal of comments around the net pertaining to Cal Kestis & his placement in the Jedi hierarchy. Most say that he is barely average Jedi Knight tier or even barely above Padawan level due to his lack of proper training & being utterly trounced by Vader (who, in canon, has force feats well above his pre-suit self). Well I'm going to attempt to prove that Cal is above average Jedi Knight tier bordering on low level Master tier. But first, I want to talk about another character: Trilla Suduri aka the Second Sister - 

Let's first start off with her name: Second Sister. Which implies (unless there is an unknown First Brother/Sister) she was the second strongest Inquisitor behind the Grand Inquisitor (who was able to defeat Jocasta Nu, a Jedi Master, in a duel). In her first two encounters with Cal, she easily trounces him, toying with him the entire time. In their second encounter, she even ragdolls him with the force:

https://giphy.com/gifs/star-wars-jedi-fallen-order-mBqIBjlVSVLAtlVuj2

While you might think, "Who cares? He's a Padawan". Well that Padawan does this earlier in the game...

https://giphy.com/gifs/star-wars-jedi-fallen-order-iIdd0bI0s81OUdEXOL

(Sorry that it is a little dark) - Cal uses his unique Slow ability to nearly freeze a large building size cyclone of debris blocking his path. I know you want to scream at the top of your lungs, "Gameplay Mechanics!". But, Cal has to slow down the debris. There is no other way to bypass it. Meaning that, while the player performs the action, it is necessary in order to advance the plot.
 
This impressive force feat happens before the aforementioned ragdoll feat & before Cal reconnects even more with the Force (which also happens before the ragdoll feat). Which means that he is noticeably stronger fighting Trilla than he was when he slowed the storm. This makes Trilla overpowering him incredibly impressive. 

Moving on - After undergoing considerable growth, Cal does to the Second Sister what she did to him, but even more casually - 

https://giphy.com/gifs/jedi-fallen-order-star-war-Rhr5EBEVgXnaelBdmI  

This happens after he has fully reconnected with the Force. This leads straigjt into my next point: Growth. While, yes, Cal starts out at upper tier Padawan level, he grows at an incredible rate throughout the game. Similar to Luke in the OT. 

Now on to my final bit of proof that Cal is stronger than you might think - His dual with fallen Jedi Master Taron Malicos. Now before you argue that we are not sure that he even was a Master, here is the description for the achievement the player gains for defeating him:










I Knew He Was No Good
25 Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Gp-g
Defeat a former Jedi Master
Now that we got that out of the way, let's see how the beginning of their duel went...

https://giphy.com/gifs/star-wars-jedi-fallen-order-TIA4WH2NmtSMI9ta2M

As you can see, judging by Malicos' expressions, how he was on the defensive, & the way the camera was focusing, he was losing the lightsaber duel. Now remember, Malicos has been stuck for 5 years on Dathomir. Eventually becoming the Nightbrothers leader. And, as the game shows, the NBs only value pure strength. This, I believe, shows that Malicos did not grow weaker after Order 66, but instead grew stronger. Due to the fact that he began to train in the Dark Side on a planet bathed in DS energies. 

Now lets move on to what Malicos does that cause Merrin to intervene in their duel - 

https://giphy.com/gifs/star-wars-jedi-fallen-order-hX1hqhDlWSQddgEoMP

While this is not looking to good for Cal's Force Defenses, I think it is actually a good showing. Only one other character has a similar feat against Cal in the game - 

https://giphy.com/gifs/star-wars-jedi-fallen-order-hW9agbx0bmhguPK3h1

Soooooo.... Yeah. While I do not think Malicos is Vader tier, I do think that this shows that one must have Master level Force power to truly over power Cal by the end of the game. 

Verdict: I believe, by the end of Jedi: Fallen Order, Cal is solidly Master tier in Sabers & High Level Knight/ Low Level Master tier in Force Power. Essentially, AotC Anakin (if you believe, like I do, that Dooku was toying with him the whole time). Or for a less controversial opinion: right above the Grand Inquisitor. 

This is the first time I have ever done something like this (I guess you could call it a Respect Thread?). Anyway, I am now prepared for an onslaught of counter-points. Have at ye 😁.
Rohirrim
Rohirrim

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 1st 2020, 6:35 pm
Message reputation : 100% (2 votes)
Nice post. I have Cal around the Grand Inquisitor and your average Jedi Master myself. Only point of contention, I'm not convinced that the Inquisitors' numbers imply any sort of hierarchy. For one, Seventh Sister and Eighth Brother seemed like more competent fighters than Fifth Brother. But Second Sister was still credited as one of the deadliest Inquisitors: https://www.starwars.com/databank/second-sister
The Slick Obi
The Slick Obi

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 1st 2020, 7:26 pm
Only reason why I think it implies rank is because, I believe, Fifth Brother mentions something about out ranking Seventh Sister during one of their Rebels squabble s.
The Slick Obi
The Slick Obi

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 1st 2020, 7:30 pm
Hmm, I might place this in the Blog section as well. Is that cool, mods?


Last edited by The Slick Obi on March 3rd 2020, 9:05 am; edited 1 time in total
BoD
BoD
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Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 1st 2020, 7:37 pm
He's less underrated than Kanan.
Underachiever599
Underachiever599

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 2nd 2020, 1:43 am
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
Cal is definitely fairly impressive. He's absolutely above your typical Padawan/Knight. His showing against Malicos in sabers is really solid, That being said, as a Force user, I'm not too terribly impressed. His ability to slow things is cool, but I believe it's been said to be an innate ability (much like Quinlan Vos' Psychometry, Sifo-Dyas' Force visions, or how naturally Force Lightning came to Dooku in Jedi Lost). 

So just because Cal demonstrates the ability to slow things, this doesn't mean characters like the Second Sister or Darth Vader can replicate those feats, even though the characters are unquestionably more powerful than Cal had been. So Vader/Malicos/The Second Sister don't necessarily scale to Cal being able to slow a cyclone, as Cal is disproportionately more capable with Slow than he is with conventional TK. 

Outside of Cal's Slow feats, he doesn't have many big Force showings throughout the game. He's definitely still above your average Jedi, but compared to any of the main characters from the shows or movies, he's still pretty much fodder. 

With all of that said, I'm really hoping to see Fallen Order get a sequel. I'd love to see the Grand Inquisitor being a recurring, or perhaps final boss. Pre-Rebels Maul might also be able to fit in the story, with Crimson Dawn being a thing. That would give us a somewhat better concept for Cal's scaling.
The Slick Obi
The Slick Obi

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 2nd 2020, 9:53 am
Hmmm, goodpoint on the fact that, since it is an innate & unique ability of his, he might be able to perform feats above his paygrade when using it. Also, I would love to see Maul. Especially since, how well Cal might perform against him, would be the perfect way to gauge his power. 

SIDENOTE: Thank you to whomever moved this to the Blog section 👍.


Last edited by The Slick Obi on March 3rd 2020, 9:05 am; edited 1 time in total
The lord of hunger
The lord of hunger
Level One
Level One

Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

on March 3rd 2020, 2:06 am
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
Great post really needed a cal thread
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Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated Empty Re: Why I think Cal Kestis is somewhat underrated

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