Knightfall vader and DE Luke vs plagueis and tenebrous

R1: dueling only 
R2: force only
R3: all out

Team 1 stomps.

KF Vader crushes Plagueis and Luke demolishes Tenebrous.

Team 1 rapes them.

R1: Team 1 stomp.
R2: Team 1, decent fight.
R3: Team 1 stomp.

ok so...after hearing the results i have other question why plagueis is wanked a lot on the vine?

Misinterpretations. There’s the belief that TPM Sheev = ROTS Sheev, when in reality ROTS Sheev had more than 10 years of growth on his TPM self.

I think Plagueis can compete with either Skywalker, but still lose. Tenebrous is out of his depth here.

KF Vader can solo.

Greysentinel365 wrote:KF Vader can solo.

what about the suited vader?

Suited Vader is a fraction of Anakin per Lucas.

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:Suited Vader is a fraction of Anakin per Lucas.

yee i know about the quote of the 80% of sidious,so if we take that as a "fact" does he can solo plagueis and tenebrous too or not?

The lord of hunger wrote:

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:Suited Vader is a fraction of Anakin per Lucas.

yee i know about the quote of the 80% of sidious,so if we take that as a "fact" does he can solo plagueis and tenebrous too or not?

No. He might beat Plagueis for a slight majority at his peak, but he’s not soloing both.

ok thx for the quick answers :3

Honestly, him having a fraction of Anakins power sounds like, as BOD would say, bollocks. I can never see Anakin stomping Vader, no matter how I look at it

lorenzo.r.2nd wrote:Honestly, him having a fraction of Anakins power sounds like, as BOD would say, bollocks. I can never see Anakin stomping Vader, no matter how I look at it

same here tbh

That's because he doesn't have a "fraction" of Anakin's power. If there's a quote for that, it's been taken out of context.

Like, I can see Vader beating Anakin at his best just as well as I see Anakin beating vader

Vader is stated to have "lost a lot of power" from his days as Anakin according to Lucas and is described as a "Shadow" of his former self in a source book. Seems pretty clear to me tbh.

No, he's stated to have "lost a lot of power" in comparison to KFV, Sidious' equal. He can be << KFV and still be > Anakin. The source book also doesn't contradict this, as Vader at this point considers Anakin to be dead so he'd be considering KFV, not Anakin.

You do realise I'm talking about KF Vader right, given he's the one in this thread? I'm calling him "Anakin" for simplicities sake, I thought it'd be obvious whom I'm referring too.

My bad, lol.

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:Vader is stated to have "lost a lot of power" from his days as Anakin according to Lucas and is described as a "Shadow" of his former self in a source book. Seems pretty clear to me tbh.

1. That quote is kinda outdated and it seems to me it's only referring to lightsaber prowess because it's going over lightsaber combat and says both Vader and Kenobi haven't fought another lightsaber wielder in years.

2. Again...it's greatly outdated, the quote should all be irrelevant given later sources.

There a few sources that contract did it, much newer too

@ZenWolf:

1. That quote is kinda outdated and it seems to me it's only referring to lightsaber prowess because it's going over lightsaber combat and says both Vader and Kenobi haven't fought another lightsaber wielder in years.

Quotes don't have an expiration date unless explicitly contradicted, and all sources that contradict this one can be thrown out, none of them are consistent with Lucas's word. Moreover, other elements of the quote being inacccurate doesn't mean we dismiss the source entirely, you'd reach pretty zany results if you applied that logic to the overall mythos, and it's illogical to do so.

2. Again...it's greatly outdated, the quote should all be irrelevant given later sources.

Per canon rules Lucas's word is absolute, no amount of C-Canon sources saying otherwise can retcon his statement, only he himself can explicitly dismiss past remarks with updated statements.

So yeah, Vader is beneath KF Anakin, by a substantial degree too, not sure why that's so hard for people to accept lol.

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:@ZenWolf:

1. That quote is kinda outdated and it seems to me it's only referring to lightsaber prowess because it's going over lightsaber combat and says both Vader and Kenobi haven't fought another lightsaber wielder in years.

Quotes don't have an expiration date unless explicitly contradicted, and all sources that contradict this one can be thrown out, none of them are consistent with Lucas's word. Moreover, other elements of the quote being acccurate doesn't mean we dismiss the source entirely, you'd reach pretty zany results if you applied that logic to the overall mythos, and it's illogical to do so.

2. Again...it's greatly outdated, the quote should all be irrelevant given later sources.

Per canon rules Lucas's word is absolute, no amount of C-Canon sources saying otherwise can retcon his statement, only he himself can explicitly dismiss past remarks with updated statements.

So yeah, Vader is beneath KF Anakin, by a substantial degree too, not sure why that's so hard for people to accept lol.

I was talking about the lightsaber bit, not the power bit. The quote says neither has fought another lightsaber wielder up until they met, but this is clearly wrong given later sources has Vader fighting Jedi out the wazoo.

But this is de-railing the topic, we're in agreement anyhow.