Suspect Insight Forums
We've moved to Discord! Join us here: https://discord.gg/b6fuSxa3uD
Suspect Insight Forums
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Go down
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 21st 2020, 12:58 pm
Message reputation : 100% (9 votes)
ADMINISTRATOR NOTE: Although this is not a Star Wars thread, it has been approved to be posted in the Star Wars Discussion forum of the Active section.

This is a collection of quotes about the psychology of Bruce Wayne, also known as Batman, with very long analysis, it took me a lot of time and research to formulate all of this, but it was worth it because Batman is a very psychologically complex character. Most of the sources that I'm going to be citing are Post-Crisis material, because that's where the best material comes from.

Note: Keep in mind that this analysis is a total of 4 posts. It's so long that I had to divide it into multiple posts.


The Aftermath of Tragedy


Psychology of Bruce Wayne JasonFabokArt

I think it's safe to assume that everyone and their grandparents knows who Batman AKA Bruce Wayne is, but I'll start by introducing his origin and background anyway. Batman, created by Bill Finger with some help from Bob Kane, first appeared in Detective Comics Issue #27 in 1939. Bruce was a rich child born in the Wayne Family and at one night, he was taken to a movie by his parents when he was 8 years old, but after they leave the theater, they encounter a thug who guns down Bruce's parents, leaving the young Bruce an orphan. His butler, Alfred Pennyworth, then became the guardian of Bruce for the rest of his life. However, Bruce was so traumatized by the experience of seeing his parents getting brutally murdered by a man with a gun, that the sheer ramifications of that trauma led to Bruce making a promise:

Batman Narration: I made a promise on the grave of my parents that I would rid this city of the evil that took their lives. By day, I am Bruce Wayne, billionaire philanthropist. At night, criminals, a cowardly and superstitious lot, call me... Batman.

Source — Batman: Hush Issue #1.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne ShhjR62Gp-d0TDo3zvQPIhrOQjAqFJq85PxNzo85CRo3p27OPtn0y309xhkfqU30ZW0zv9E2DV9f=s0

Batman: It was from an alley like this one that a man with a gun emerged from the darkness and murdered my mother and father. In that single moment, my childhood ended. I made a promise on the grave of my parents that I would rid this city of the evil that took their lives. Tonight... I nearly became a part of that evil...

Source Batman: Hush Issue #7.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne CtHPxVuCFGq5pHd2oQQ2PSDOkNzRIkGaBavAja2T7BPEMfUFtSwrE_jmIQF023FMuZ11IK1E1A6i=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne ZYkpeC0tt5aBVpYK1h_Om0-7zfItynj3uu6Sk5_1X9ozwx-IHy_COyLH_jk9CMX1o_IoJoxsqmO1=s0

Batman: I made a promise on the grave of my slain parents. I would not rest until Gotham city was washed clean of the evil that took their lives. There could be no compromises.

Source — Batman: The Long Halloween Issue #1.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO027

As Bruce himself says, he made a promise on the grave of his parents that he would rid his city of the evil that took their lives and his childhood ended the moment a man with a gun emerged from a dark alleyway and murdered his parents in that alleyway. Alfred goes into more detail about it here:

Alfred Pennyworth: My name is Alfred Pennyworth. I have been in the employ of the Wayne family nearly all my adult life. I have told this story to no one. Until now... Dr Thomas and Martha Wayne were good people. Many considered them the first family of Gotham city. If they had one indulgence, it would be for their son, Master Bruce. Something I have come to understand and emulate. I cannot imagine the man young Bruce might have become had his childhood not been ripped from him at gunpoint. Suddenly orphaned and alone, a chilling event took place. There would be no grieving for this child. No time would be lost wishing he could change these events. There would only be the promise. That very night, on the street stained with his mother and father's blood, he would make a vow to rid the city of the evil that had taken their lives. It was at best, a fool's errand, or so I told myself. Using his family's wealth, Master Bruce sought out the world's greatest minds in criminology, martial arts, and the craft of detecting. He knew that criminals are, by nature, a cowardly and superstitious lot. In turn, he donned a cape and cowl and became a creature of the night, preying on those who broke the law. They now call him The Batman. But, I will always see him as that little boy, lost, struggling to find a way to make up for not being able to save his parents lives. And I...? I can only offer him something I fear he sorely lacks. Love.

Source — Batman: The Complete Hush.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 2

As Alfred describes, the murders of Thomas and Martha Wayne had Bruce's childhood "ripped from him at gunpoint" and "suddenly orphaned and alone, a chilling event took place" and that "There would be no time for grieving" and "No time would be lost wishing he could change these events" because "There would only be the promise" which was "That very night, on the street stained with his mother and father's blood, he would make a vow to rid the city of the evil that had taken their lives" which Alfred considered "at best, a fool's errand," but Bruce nonetheless pursued by using his family's wealth to seek out "the world's greatest minds in criminology, martial arts, and the craft of detecting" because Bruce needed to acquire certain skills, knowledge and training in order to try fulfilling his promise of ridding Gotham of the evil that took his parents' lives. But more importantly, Bruce knew that criminals in Gotham were "by nature, a cowardly and superstitious lot" so he had the desire of creating a vigilante persona that would strike fear into the hearts of Gotham's criminals, and for that reason, he took on the image of a bat, becoming "a creature of the the night, preying on those who broke the law" thus becoming known as the Batman. Though Batman was feared by Gotham's criminal underworld, Alfred always saw Bruce as "that little boy, lost, struggling to find a way to make up for not being able to save his parents lives" and could only offer Bruce one thing he feared Bruce "sorely lacks" i.e. love, which probably has something to do with the fact that Bruce was scarred for life by the terrible trauma of helplessly watching his parents getting brutally murdered by a man with a gun. All of this is very nicely complimented by this OOU source:

"Spider-Man

His beloved uncle's life stolen by a desperate burglar's bullet — a murder he could have prevented — Peter Parker learned that with great power comes great responsibility, and has vowed to use his superhuman abilities to ensure that no one else would suffer because he failed to act.

Batman

His childhood forever shattered when he witnessed the brutal slayings of his parents, Bruce Wayne trained his body and mind to human perfection, becoming a Dark Knight, obsessed with justice, and determined to free the night from the criminal predators that infest it.

Two frighteningly similar tragedies... Two very different heroes.

Now these two must join forces against the combined evil of two of their most nightmarish foes: the maniacal Clown Prince of Crime, the Joker, and the bloodthirsty symbiote serial killer, CARNAGE!

And before the battle ends, both Spider-Man and Batman will be forced to confront their deepest, most hidden fears head on... As they stalk through the dark corridors off... Disordered Minds."
Spider-Man and Batman: Disordered Minds.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 4rI30ESmySZdyf_PkYoE8lVgJ74wVF0ZaMPx5M2lkrCyr4HNbYpKjuKO1WXqR8k2tKjzqRLbz5Up=s0   

Spider-Man and Batman: Disordered Minds is a crossover comic co-published by Marvel and DC Comics; the synopsis of this story compares and contrasts Batman and Spider-Man's origin stories, stating that they have experienced "frighteningly similar tragedies" but are "two very different heroes" nonetheless. For Batman, the synopsis states: "His childhood forever shattered when he witnessed the brutal slayings of his parents, Bruce Wayne trained his mind and body to human perfection, becoming a Dark Knight," which isn't any different from what Alfred and Bruce said about the psychological ramifications of the murders of Thomas and Martha Wayne, but the synopsis expands upon that by saying Bruce became "obsessed with justice, and determined to free the night from the criminal predators that infest it." This is one of the core elements of Batman's character; that he is driven by obsession. Batman is obsessed with the impossible goal of eradicating crime and corruption in Gotham. Bruce Wayne made a promise to rid his city of the evil that took his parents away from him, and his childhood by extension, so he trained his mind and body to mental and physical perfection, obtained a set of useful skills, knowledge and training, and spends virtually every night operating as a vigilante, waging a personal war against organised crime. This source provides good insight on Batman's war on crime from Batman himself:

Bruce: I am the Batman, a grim soul fighting a relentless war on crime. Cloaked in shadows, I prey on the forces of evil. Determined to strike terror throughout the underworld, I adopted the fearsome image of a bat. To prepare myself for the battle, I developed my mind, mastering science and criminology. I pushed myself to the limits of human endurance, training my body to physical perfection... All the while driven by the pain of my worst memory—the night a criminal stepped from the shadows and tore my world apart. In a heartbeat I had lost the two most important people in my life. It was this loss that changed me forever... The night a grief stricken boy made a solemn oath he would never forget. I buried my parents here when I was eight. Since that day, part of me has always been bound to this place. To the memories of innocent people destroyed by crime. Ghosts long departed and Ghosts who still wait.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO005
Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO006
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Scan

Bruce states that he is "driven by the pain of" his "worst memory—the night a criminal stepped from the shadows and tore" his "world apart." Within a mere pulse, Bruce "had lost the two most important people" in his life and it changed him forever. So he subsequently "made a solemn oath he would never forget" i.e. rid his city of the evil that took their lives by waging war against organised crime. He buried his parents when he was 8 years old, but since that day, part of him had "always been bound" to his parents' graves to "the memories of innocent people destroyed by crime" and also the "Ghosts long departed and Ghosts who still wait."

In my eyes, the most important and obvious reason for why Bruce made the choice to fight crime is how Alfred himself put it: Bruce is trying to make up for not being able to save his parents' lives from the common criminal, otherwise known as Joe Chill. The sheer horror of seeing his parents get gunned down by such scum, and being absolutely powerless to save them, scarred Bruce for life, like it would to any normal person in such circumstances. Bruce doesn't want others to suffer the horrific trauma of losing their family to the scumbags that infest their city. He's dedicated his adult life to waging a personal war against organised crime, not simply out of a need for revenge, but to protect the innocent, so that no one goes what Bruce and his parents went through in that terrible, fateful night in Crime Alley. It's "at best, a fool's errand," as Alfred himself stated, because it's impossible. Batman's bodyguard, Sasha Bordeaux thinks the same:

Sasha Bordeaux: His life is a share of tragedies. It created him, and will assuredly end him as well. He cannot escape it. Starting in that moment when Bruce Wayne saw his parents gunned down before his eyes... Sent from this world without reason by a man who wanted their money and contented himself with taking their lives... A moment he lives again every night. Perhaps that was where Batman was born. In that alley, where Thomas and Martha Wayne lost their last breath. Perhaps it came earlier. Perhaps it was always meant to be this way. But it is that tragedy that drives him. A vow made to his parents, to their memory. Not solely to avenge. To protect. To keep what happened to him from ever happening to another soul. To become the man who could keep that promise. For over a decade he travelled the globe... Acquiring the skills he would need... Honing his mind as he honed his body... Becoming a detective as much as a warrior... Preparing himself for the day he would return home to Gotham. The day he could finally begin. He diverted suspicion. Made Bruce Wayne a man of the society pages. He thought he was ready. His first attempt nearly killed him. All he had done, all he had learned, and it wasn't enough. He needed to something more. To become something more. And he did. Carrying the fight forward to the streets of Gotham, trying to shield the innocent... Striving to punish the guilty. Every night now for over ten years. Doomed to failure, again and again. Because it is a true fool's errand. Because his quest is impossible. Even if the lunatics did not exist... Even if men like the Joker and women like Poison Ivy were locked securely away forever... Parents would still be murdered... Children would still become orphans. And before someone thinks that the foolish errand makes the one who pursues it a fool himself, let me clarify: He knows all this better than anyone. But he does it anyway. Heedless of the cost to himself... Painfully aware of the cost to others. He never talks about that, about what he's sacrificed... About what he's denied himself... About the friends he's driven away... Or the isolation he feels. He doesn't talk about much, actually. Only his work.

Source — Batman: Bruce Wayne - Murderer?

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne HHjTSZWugheUjHXm_kwNYmEw6w5Av3TvaLz0h1PAT1BS4naCxI2ehAElIgklAtHjGAJqH9rRrw3X=s0 Psychology of Bruce Wayne A73ZfajHNAOdluGY5L8OSkd-I4QY9OX8zI3G_4k_eyN6oDxHki4AAx2658HsNXTNFkRDDy_9wX82=s0 Psychology of Bruce Wayne QcAUYmzPCnOAj8B54Y7dpE26Fv9QZ0De0IeVyYZxmnKn1pCoXGkyEKX86apXBVF_P_rFBOnh_lRw=s0 Psychology of Bruce Wayne LvScHyAA9F3kYScgxkzJtcp3Q6YVMO-E-jrPkywU3W7BRGv7Dk6dJbnn2xU1WsLAkxDZrKBhQDNG=s0 Psychology of Bruce Wayne K0wp1pLe-tWym3PkPlPYu-0F1ZpnaCvk1KwBtNT8HUEEH1A_G8XKOAggC99Z-9ggTyMFn99D3jvf=s0

Batman's goal of trying to make sure what happened to him doesn't happen to others is impossible. It's doomed to failure because there's only so much that one man, even with the resources, wealth and drive that Bruce has, can do to stop parents from being murdered and children becoming orphans. Bruce relives his parents' murder every night. He knows it's an impossible goal, but still pursues it because he's obsessed. He is so obsessed with that goal that there's the recurring theme that Bruce Wayne is the mask, and Batman is the real identity. Bruce lives a double life, at day he is a billionaire philanthropist, at night he's Batman. One of Bruce's methods of hiding his double life from the public is that by day, he puts on the facade that he is a billionaire playboy i.e. an arrogant, drunken spoilt brat who drinks and parties too much:

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO091_w_1578007761 Psychology of Bruce Wayne QlI-vfHpMZ9MnMCpz-5f4p2JDxa4LyNoW-8LSgVPItMalAFaqHay7t598bbaFkgQdnpAFJPF4jMk7OJxiYiWh8c-0xb2qJuLbpB4_Mz1IoZvoyW_gaWlHtPjsKU5BxoXbqqdaUK97A=s0

Source — Batman: The Man Who Laughs.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne VB-VcZz2v7X0Sf-UffIAFl-v6TSrWDkgxU2QWQfACh2F2AaHlwuYd6ELzRxbk6Ni1rGIMG7Cu-pb=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne VdOyCNBpNWDdiXVp3OKtFCIYWWIga-vHko6_AgWOjwyhBVJQZPHhys2LNBKC4H1tcMTAwvDBajwU=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Cz4iiqeA1ZlWs6UUa5EFUhHv94FrTV91HJ4W0Rj1KVglP1jXEOEUSx-g8x6FdPedauuP21biJbpv=s0

This billionaire playboy facade enables Bruce to prevent too many people from deducing that he's Batman because most people in Gotham will laugh at the idea that some drunken idiot like Bruce Wayne could be Batman, they'd assume that he's too busy having a fling with some supermodel, getting drunk or trying to sleep off hangovers. But another reason why most people in Gotham don't suspect that Bruce Wayne is Batman is because many people in Gotham aren't even convinced that Batman actually exists; they just think that he's a myth that the GCPD made up to scare criminals. Many people who do believe that he exists, aren't even sure if he's even human because Batman is an urban legend who hides in the shadows, giving off a mythical and supernatural aura:

Bruce: To much of the city I am a Ghost. An urban bogeyman often discussed but rarely seen, more vivid in rumour than reality.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO010

Batman doesn't care about what people think and say about him when seeing him put on the demeanor that he's a billionaire playboy because Bruce Wayne is just a mask, whereas Batman is the true identity. The night that Bruce saw his mother's pearls dropped from her necklace, whilst watching his mother and father dying in an alleyway, was when Bruce died and Batman was born. No, Bruce did not literally become Batman at the time of their deaths because he didn't have the skills, knowledge, training, gadgets, batsuit et al. until many years later. But what he did have from that dark, fateful night, was the drive to fight crime and protect the innocent. Bruce Wayne is the mask that enables Batman to gather his resources from Wayne Enterprises in the war against crime. Bruce Wayne is the mask and cover story that enables Batman to remain anonymous and have the freedom to pursue his goal of purging crime and corruption from his city. Be that as it may, Bruce Wayne might be dead, but Batman still holds onto the humanity and virtues that he got from his mother and father when he was a child. An fundamental part of what makes Batman is his empathy and compassion, the reason why he is so obsessed with the impossible goal of trying to make sure others don't go through the pain he went through, is because of his empathy and compassion. Batman is also a dark, terrifying, demon who Bruce first encountered as a child when he fell into a well of bats, then it became a part of his psyche when he saw his parents die, and it was finally ready to reveal itself when Bruce saw a bat fly through a window in Wayne Manor, prompting Bruce to become a bat. By becoming a bat, Bruce becomes more than just a man in the eyes of his enemies; he becomes a creature of the night. But it's Bruce Wayne's humanity and virtues that enable him to restrain his natural instincts for violence and revenge, hence why he has a moral code. Without that, he wouldn't be able to fulfil the promise he made to his parents, he would just be a vengeance driven vigilante.

Without dumping too much psychoanalysis on identity crisis and shit, the way I see it is that Batman and Bruce Wayne are different facets of the same psyche that appear at different times and places, which isn't anything out of the ordinary because we all show different aspects of our personalities at different times and places. Many people exhibit different aspects of their personalities whether they be around their family, their friends, the people they work, above or under in the workplace, and maybe even the people they interact with in an online community. Just look at Sheev Palpatine's life:

"Relaxing back into the padded seat, he exhaled for what felt like the first time all day. In the space of a standard year he had gone from leading two lives to managing almost half a dozen: apprentice to Plagueis; Master to Maul; distinguished Senator; ally of Supreme Chancellor Valorum; and leader of a growing cabal of conspirators that included Pestage, Doriana, Greejatus — in line to replace him in the Senate — the Force-sensitive human Sim Aloo, intelligence analyst Armand Isard, Eriadu Senator Wilhuff Tarkin, and Umbaran telepath Sly Moore, whom he had made his covert aide." — Darth Plagueis Novel.

Batman exhibits himself at night in the presence of criminals, "a cowardly and superstitious lot," and law enforcement such as Jim Gordon. Bruce Wayne, the billionaire playboy, exhibits himself to the public.

Before I move on, there is still more to say about how Bruce was affected by the night his parents were murdered. At the very start of his crime fighting career, Bruce reflects on that night, saying the following:

Bruce: ... Eighteen years... Since... Since Zorro. The Mask of Zorro. Since that walk. That night. And the man with the frightened, hollow eyes and a voice like glass being crushed... Since all sense left my life.

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 7GEJDD3onZB-mutDjPnR-9ZYHbplrsIS1Da0TH1aOKfqgzVYf3nS65WuJuxcp1AAPAqVFhYhGKNgC7p4KbwteDPdinT-3pZZiLiEKDVBz8-QlvG5MxkUDtTAmW59cqfgwn88ReyvjA=s0

What's interesting is that many years later, a 55 year old Batman who is on the verge of ending his career, had this to say:

Bruce: You sold us out, Clark. You gave them the power that should have been ours. Just like your parents taught you. My parents taught me a different lesson... Lying on this street... Shaking in deep shock... Dying for no reason at all. They showed me that the world only makes sense when you force it to.

Source — The Dark Knight Returns Issue #4.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne L_UZerNkLHdWImt4x7dQqSZ5HtGluGqGYlpjBEwC34zmfj1yW1vmoAiAweevizEOXrv1rySsjDLb=s0

Shortly before becoming Batman, Bruce says that "all sense left" his life the night his parents were murdered. But after years of being Batman, retiring as Batman, coming out of retirement, and shortly before retiring again, he says that the night his parents were murdered "for no reason at all" showed him something, which was "that the world only makes sense when you force it to" which is in stark contrast to him saying that his life stopped making sense the night they were murdered. He's illlustrating how the violent nature of his parents' deaths and the lack of reason Chill had for murdering them are what motivated him to fight crime in the first place i.e. Batman is Bruce's method of making sense out of why his parents were murdered. Bruce became a crime fighter because he made a promise on his parents graves to rid his city of the evil prevent others from going through the pain he went through. So he's essentially forcing his parents' deaths to make sense by deciding to use his own pain and trauma to help others, hence why he says that his parents showed him "that the world only makes sense when you force it to."

That's enough about the psychological ramifications of an 8 year old Bruce Wayne witnessing his parents' murders, now I'm going to move on:

Why Bruce Wayne became a Bat




After Bruce returned to Gotham from his global quest of seeking the means to fight the evil that took his parents' lives, he began his career as a non-costumed crime fighter, but his debut was a failure, and he needed something else:

Narrator: The Indian Shaman who rescued him wore the mask of a beast sacred to his tribe. The mask of the bat. Later, the old man said "You have the mark. In your eyes. The mask of a bat." Master Kirigi had also said Bruce was marked. As he returned to Wayne Manor, Bruce had the feeling that the universe was taunting him--defying him to solve a riddle. Something about bats and his mission. He was, he knew, a superbly trained detective. Probably the best in the world. But he had no franchise, no direction. His debut as a crime fighter was a dismal failure. Humiliated, he retired to the library where once his father had studied medical texts. He opened a century old volume and read: "Criminals are a cowardly and superstitious lot." He heard a faint noise at the window -- a hissing, a chittering. Then, only the ticking and the creaks and groans of an old house. He knew, in that single instant, he understood what his direction had been all these years, what was possible to him -- what he had to be. For a moment, he quietly savored a new emotion. For a moment, he was happy. Something that he had never existed before -- a nocturnal avenger -- relentless and compassionate -- at once human -- and less than human -- and more. It had to be a name, this being he created and became. He called it the Batman.

Source — Secret Origins: The Man Who Falls.

Spoiler:


Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO020 Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO021 Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO022

This is a brief retelling of events that happened in Batman: Year One:

Bruce: Father... I'm afraid I may have to die to tonight. I've tried to be patient. I've tried to wait. But I have to know. How, father? How do I do it? What do I use... To make them afraid? If I ring this bell... Afred will come. He can stop the bleeding, in time. Another one of your gifts to me, father. I have wealth. The family manor rests above a huge cave that will be the perfect headquarters... Even a butler with training in combat medicine... Yes father. I have everything but patience. I'd rather die... Than wait... Another hour. I have waited... Eighteen years... Eighteen years... Since... Since Zorro. The Mask of Zorro. Since that walk. That night. And the man with the frightened, hollow eyes and a voice like glass being crushed... Since all sense left my life. Without warning, it comes... Crashing through the window of your study... And mine... I have seen it before... Somewhere... It frightened me... As a boy... Frightened me... Yes. Father. I shall become a bat.

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Xi2SaZzLoRog9VHSr5TpeK0lTG2C1oyBI53rwr63_P_ofJWciR9-BLWCKWroLR3063ga4PUnYic7QTIaq9k6hCHd8l7PeFaXb64FIIgj7voRG2WTIFasOiAVc469thOUcSygPXM1bg=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 7GEJDD3onZB-mutDjPnR-9ZYHbplrsIS1Da0TH1aOKfqgzVYf3nS65WuJuxcp1AAPAqVFhYhGKNgC7p4KbwteDPdinT-3pZZiLiEKDVBz8-QlvG5MxkUDtTAmW59cqfgwn88ReyvjA=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne GQOyYiJajvRnDIqckidvjL5fGRWaKUKn_ojqqm5ohjaSRNf6UfDTarhtli3YnIdjgFNtvOc0nC7UekX1MMKkShKtZW3-xBPjEBA_r6LrSoyI_5bmWXILw5o39-kUKMXiRfOXY1QyWw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne R-DVw-W6gYP0977U_UlO-IgVefWFK3ISIAZwzOMm1QVyScTtu98tPwAT83MJAjugLQ_9OBou5zftMD9LokFHCVv9HJKv7o33G9zBYEwtPG25CFFADWHkCaDANfZWuHaMcRJYeVx-TA=s0

After coming home from his failed debut as a crime fighter, Bruce went to his father's library to recuperate, knowing that everything he had learned wasn't enough, he also needed something to make his enemies afraid. As if his ruminations were answered, a bat crashes through a window in Wayne Manor, inspiring Bruce to "become a bat" because he was once frightened by bats as a child. This is a reference to Bruce's experience of falling into a well of bats:

Source — The Dark Knight Returns Issue #1.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne X3IKXsv5WCOFVnUaQVhTPDVjoj1S2vZ_nqf0vpfr8isurijuyv1OgUpCNfSh05D-JiTKnJpE9ikd=s0 Psychology of Bruce Wayne 45X-F6vAW0CPagAUzZo9O3G9K5VQWHythZ_cunNsCJIulU9wE8vVg66sMSW_uAULPCfTLrwFpTEB=s0 Psychology of Bruce Wayne GjybljbS7OE1idQPUs3Y98QLnCEZ8guxoVNfxt9UPB_Ty4FO3oDuLm3NbDlgYO7lz97c7rza0YMh=s0

When taking on the guise of a bat, Bruce became "a nocturnal avenger -- relentless and compassionate -- at once human -- and less than human -- and more." He became a personification of the childhood fear that he encountered when he fell into that well of bats. Fear was an essential tool in Batman's war against organised crime, it's often repeated in Batman stories that criminals in Gotham are a "a cowardly and superstitious lot," and Bruce exploited that by becoming a bat:

Batman: Criminals, by nature, are a cowardly and superstitious lot. To instill feat into their hearts I became a bat. A monster in the night. And in doing so, have I become the very thing that all monsters become... Alone...?

Source Batman: Hush Issue #
3.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne TUJYjnYQutNCKahcxlXix1oI_6oXPClMWGxbZK5FpaJTQeAgbfjRmbkl7P_6C7NlF0xUyn1_5tWL=s0

As Bruce puts it, when taking on the guise of a bat, he becomes a "monster in the night" in the eyes of criminals, superstitious cowards that would believe in stuff that's mythical and supernatural, including the the idea that they're going to get pursued by a giant bat at night for committing crimes. Criminals are afraid of Batman because they don't perceive him as some guy in a costume, they perceive him as something inhuman and animal like:

Bruce: To much of the city I am a Ghost. An urban bogeyman often discussed but rarely seen, more vivid in rumour than reality. Glimpsed fleetingly in shadow, possessed of seemingly inhuman powers. I have become, through imaginations and nightmares, a creature to be avoided. The aura of fear that I project is my most potent weapon. It triggers panic, giving me the advantage in my attack. It acts as a barrier, warning the innocent and curious to keep their distance. Even those who fixate on challenging the "Batman" recoil in horror when I finally confront them.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO009
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 7738342-2

To "much of the city" Batman is a "Ghost" and "An urban bogeyman often discussed but rarely seen, more vivid in rumour than reality" who is "Glimpsed fleetingly in the shadow, possessed of seemingly inhuman powers" and becoming "a creature to be avoided." Bruce also talks about what he created Batman for here:

Bruce: I know. But that is a consideration. But it's what you said earlier... I created Batman to project an image. It succeeded. To be effective, the symbol has to be greater then the reality.

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #442.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne DLCbQE6Csyx_ZzzMqpm6VvJQB97QR4P7fVJOPidJqMEiwRmWQ-75ZKwAmZMzfJJ-BSjA9tgLuQao32pXTUiGD7O6q6J4IHMYnLXxgFUnDA-LbFyG78PJnjaCF0QwFWCoY5JKN1xWMQ=s0

Bruce "created Batman to project an image" to criminals, and in order "To be effective, the symbol has to be greater than the reality"  and it succeeded because he became a creature of the night, rather than a man in a costume. Sure, Batman might not kill criminals, but that doesn't mean he won't hurt them. A good beating from Batman could leave you with shattered teeth, broken limbs and fractured bones. Few would want to go through all that physical punishment, especially given that Batman's refusal to kill means that you'll have to go through that entire recovery process, which I imagine to be terribly bothersome, not just because of the pain, but also the hospital bills. That's not the only reason why criminals in Gotham are afraid of Batman; they also don't know much about Batman because he is an urban legend. Batman is rarely seen, people on the streets of Gotham aren't sure if Batman has super powers, if he can be killed, if he is human, what he wants, why he does what he does. All they do know is that when he shows up, he’s a wrecking ball, striking quickly and vanishing:

Bruce: Night after night I'm there, waging my fight against crime in whatever form it takes. I strike quickly and vanish, a vengeful extension of the darkness. My unspoken message swiftly spreads throughout the streets: Someone's watching, and he's angry.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO071

Batman strikes quickly and vanishes like "a vengeful extension of the darkness" that delivers an "unspoken message" which "swiftly spreads throughout the streets" that "Someone's watching, and he's angry."

What's even more fearsome about Batman is he exhibits this stalkerish and invincible nature; he appears and disappears on a dime, knows where criminals operate, solves seemingly unsolvable crimes, ruins their operations, shrugs off whatever his adversaries throw at him, making the himself appear all the more fearsome and unstoppable in the eyes of criminals. Batman's use of martial arts, stealth, gadgets, detective skills, willpower and animal like guise is what enable him to achieve all this:

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne _UXIwU9Jos-t5R3zRdtG5bC4Dy4-yWlDxq7UqwUOs9Pl6YMMcA_crzkXGtXgpb_fnL63-F7-3Tnq-korieipvSro73PnQHIwZ8f8iX3DO61AWV-Grl4c2vgCT1kYcMCV7beuIZLOhw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne PEx5lKeqqzKp3jVXZSROsUJ1U5Hh6YlbNWBIQaNq7YQBfrTZKGrhzmLeiKieHaZtcCdS8I5i6qm51a3OrJWST-IwhRWeM0uZHGvbn6zski_DQjgjXdpmXERfTcx7OBmFx_GQjJz7Eg=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 0cNUGIN8aDBagxL2nFARQXuzfM2gFfUjGMcfzIYcGTRGdqm39SoUKiRnOkYPxa20thDsnZJElvCYGb6YOKbJ0khSKxyO6EEop83tKtMujks4K1JPnMKeQHkmYbyAt5TpPtpCZMLWOA=s0

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:
Psychology of Bruce Wayne YWEboVzFegLO-Z_F6lHyQ5vbKrpTPoO8e3gtJ8Rz2w1GGmIczZ2XWix13LZulT85Pw25Xaf5zRVEF_U-BE3PKCN7H1Lt78w9Tn7FH192K2pHcXpWYkAj9hRXCm9_pPHtppZhytoyKA=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne H8hV_Zr4gZei8Xb8SzZvqXGU20I7IEYem5cZKTze3A0OkLhfwV18AiCciZIoVLmJhBQYzJU9ogE0m6KETNh0QScE8ugY2NgjttiZtYry4d5ZrxkJjRBBZRQc3OL1C8N_P8bO_2fsgw=s0

Source — The Dark Knight Returns Issue #1.

Spoiler:
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Si6qsRaTd0QHw8Ap1y_m7SzZVKqrWoit-HSwpDfeWHjMV0U5lHyDjMTYoDRk-NzZ5C2SgTbKwZwC=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne K9BghfNxNetdaKeJIZZLTf22YRSWVuYC11H36U2AiBfMQa57jekc7jr5fmlLnTfLqPfiS27StHip=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 8bAx9KknSA3DWihW8pB01wvMGUGxc1ny34msnYEVPVDhd1R1l16_RwVV1gRWRaoSbbfV8686t8NI=s0

Source — The Dark Knight Returns Issue #1.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne TKDR

Source — The Dark Knight Returns Issue #2.

Spoiler:
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1
Psychology of Bruce Wayne WLPG-15Cgyr8Q2yGC1PKpLyR_VVnOFHNIAWXo8lmIpGp1U3VchJDnhJmbUm7Tef7J2C0cfX3uT6A=s0

Here are some live action and animated examples of the creature of the night:









People have shot him, cut him, hired gangs to break him, used toxins, booby traps, explosions, drugs... Anything you can think to destroy him. They've tried it all, so many times. But he keeps coming back. And when he's in serious trouble, he can summon backup like this:





So it's no surprise that criminals are afraid of this guy. Even when disregarding the creature of the night aspect of Batman, he's still someone to be afraid of because he has an arsenal greater than an entire police force, e.g. gadgets, body armor, batmobile, batwing, batboat and many more. He's an endless well of resources and there's virtually nothing that can be done to cut his funding. Entire groups of SWAT teams can do nothing to subdue Batman because of his arsenal and resources. All things considered, bats have symbolic meanings in many different cultures, which I will now touch upon:

Symbolism of Bats


Psychology of Bruce Wayne Batcave_art

Many people fear bats because they can fly, typically come out of night, are hard to see because they hide in the dark, can bite you and suck your blood. Bats hide in dark and desolate places such as caves, ruins and tombs during the day, hanging upside down while sleeping. Their ghostly and beastly appearances can be alarming, especially when they flap their wings at night. But worst of all, disturbing one bat might awaken an entire horde of bats that will all fly at once. It's no wonder that encounters with bats leave people unsettled, disturbed and scared.

In medieval culture in Europe, bats were symbols of evil because many medieval Europeans considered bats to be demonic because their ability to fly led to bats being symbolized as messengers of the biblical Satan, which explains why the biblical Satan is often imagined as a man with horns and wings. Bats later became symbols of Count Dracula and Vampires because a sub-family of bats, called Desmodontinae, also known as vampire bats, drink blood from domestic animals and even humans. Dracula had powers that included some level of command over wild animals, including bats, and Dracula himself could also shapeshift into a bat.

In Native American culture, some Native Americans considered bats sinister and threatening because they believed they symbolize death and rebirth because they live a cycle of going underground caverns during day and coming out in the open during the night, symbolizing death and rebirth in that they let go of the old at day and become new at night. Encounters with bats were also considered omens. Some believed that encounters with bats was a sign of rebirth in that your life is going to end in one way, but become new in another way.

As for how this relates to Bruce Wayne, I think Bruce's experience of falling into the well of bats as a child was a sign that his life with his parents was going to end sooner than later, and that he would be reborn as something else. Bruce was only 6 years old when he fell into that well, and his parents died only two years later. The alleyway that Bruce's parents were murdered was the same alleyway that Bruce was reborn as Batman:

Narrator: The East End. Crime Alley.

Jason: It seemed only fitting, huh? The place of your "birth." The place of our first meeting. And now... Where it ends.

Bruce: Where is he!?

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #649.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Df7ve7AiAyyPMoOYCyMmZzidDDwIa1mhL74EWMttGv_d18y9bwfRJiRkZYoxPppBAP4En_DQQ6dv=s0

I also think that by dressing up as a bat, Bruce is taking the iconography of something evil, which is exhibited through the demonic image and methods he uses at night, even though he has values of a virtuous man. Bats are symbols of evil in many cultures and traditions, and people are always fascinated by evil, largely because it's an unacknowledged part of every one of us. We all have a capacity for evil, but what we do have is free will i.e. the ability to choose between good and evil. Dennis O'Neill and various other people have given fascinating descriptions of what they think Bruce's choice of adopting the image of a bat symbolizes:

Robert Clotworthy: In the early 20th century, Swiss psychiatrist Carl Young explored the link between the conscious and the unconscious mind. Young believed that in all of us, a struggle wages between the socially acceptable self, and "the shadow self."

Dennis O'Neill: Batman embodies the shadow side. He looks like evil, he operates like an evil guy. He operates outside society, and yet his values... Are the values of a virtuous man. He is a perfect union of the two sides of all of us; the good, and the evil that co-exists in human life.

Robert Clotworthy: In "Batman Begins," Bruce's choice to take on the identity of a bat not only taps into his own childhood fears, but into the fear most people have about the flying creatures.

Bejamin Karney: In popular culture, a bat is a threat; it comes out at night, it's something you can't really see, but it can bite you! It can suck your blood!

Dennis O'Neill: So what Batman does is take the iconography of evil. Look at medieval paintings of devils, demons; they have often horns and bat wings. Bats in every culture except the Chinese that I know about are symbols of evil, of the dark side, of death, of Satan! And that fascinates us! People are always fascinated by evil, partially I think because it's an unacknowledged part of every one of us, and Batman puts that in your face!

Bejamin Karney: History has a lot of people taking examples of taking symbols that are initially negative, initially hateful even, and getting ownership of them! In the Nazi era, homosexuals were branded or forced to wear a pink triangle. Well, in recent decades, the pink triangle has become a symbol of liberation for homosexuals. Bruce Wayne's done the same thing; he's taken a symbol of all that is scary, unpredictable and chaotic in the night, in the world, and owned it.

Jeffrey Lieberman: By the same token, you could say that the choice of a bat, which is able to soar above society, upwards towards the heavens, represents this aspirational purpose or dynamic that seems to be motivating his behaviour.

Christian Bale: He's created this symbol, and that symbol can't have limits, he can't show weakness ever. And so, you have the fight between what is good for Bruce Wayne, and what is the right thing to do for Batman, and the two of them are not always compatible.

Source ― The Psychology Of The Dark Knight: Batman Unmasked

Full video:



Christian Bale, who plays Bruce Wayne AKA in Christopher Nolan's Batman trilogy, hits the nail on the head when describing Batman symbolizes for Bruce because it's very close to what Bruce says in Going Sane:

Batman: No mask, no cape, no utility belt―but every day he puts himself on the line. Wades, hip-deep, into the sewage of this city and takes his stand. Just once I'd like to sit down with him... Talk to him like a friend. Ask him about the struggles and triumphs, the dreams and fears, that shaped him. And maybe share some of my struggles with him. But I can't, can I? I'm the Batman. I don't struggle. I don't feel. I move through the shadows, the vanish―like morning mist―in the light of day. If I'd stepped out of the shadows just then... If Gordon has seen the stiffness in my leg, even a hint of simple human pain in my eyes, the illusion would have been shattered. Not just for him―but for me. And the next time I wade into the sewage... I just might sink.

Source ― Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight issue #67.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne P2UoNfwmh_E-iXn4FUrTZXxtdMGP0DbKG-ZyRH7qpYWpNYFf-0wPf8QprooWDElV4k0bTS8ywXO5=s0

That's all for part 1. Part 2 will be up next.


Last edited by Latham2000 on April 10th 2021, 6:10 am; edited 36 times in total
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 21st 2020, 12:59 pm
Message reputation : 100% (8 votes)

Part 2:


Is Batman an Appropriate Response to Crime and Corruption in Gotham?


Psychology of Bruce Wayne 53694e3498d0c83d6a43d69bcd85e38e

Just like in his own universe, Batman's methods of fighting crime and corruption in Gotham have received a lot of scrutiny from real world critics who have made erroneous arguments against Batman. For instance, SJWs have been demonizing Batman by spreading this pretentious, cringe inducing, meme worthy rhetoric all over the internet. This rhetoric is mostly uttered on Twitter, a cesspool for retards, contrarians and SJWs, going along the lines of something like this:

"Batman is just some rich guy who beats up the poor and mentally ill for his own enjoyment, and could do so much more if he just remained Bruce Wayne and used his wealth to get rid of crime in Gotham city!"

There is so much wrong with this rhetoric that I wasn't sure where to begin. I'll just start with refuting the lie that Batman beats up criminals for his own sadistic enjoyment:

Bruce: And I wonder what Alan thinks of that. The savage part of what being Batman is about. I don't enjoy hurting people, but it has to be done.

Source — Detective Comics (1937) Issue #786.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne EiM-p4b_MwDox93UQRtT3FkLh8o5j48eBPeGkOffVUHr5SrR2uFHmAgHrF28UvYiExCwr1JrxU64=s0

Bruce explicitly states that he doesn't like hurting people (i.e. criminals and supervillains), but it has to be done. This has something to do with the fact that criminals and supervillains in Gotham are cruel, homicidal people who prey on the innocent and have information about what goes on in the criminal underworld, so they leave Batman no choice but to hurt them whenever he encounters them. Let's also not forget that Bruce is saying this in his own internal thoughts, he's not talking to anyone, he's contemplating. People are far less likely to lie when contemplating internally than people who are having verbal conversations with others. So no, Batman does not indulge in the act of beating up criminals.

Secondly, the people that Batman "beats up" aren't always "poor" and "mentally ill" because Gotham is infested with organised crime. Sure, Batman does fight petty criminals when seeing them commit robberies and shit, but the criminals that Batman usually faces are people who work for organised mob bosses who have a lot of wealth and resources e.g. Carmine Falcone, Salvatore Maroni, Penguin and the Black Mask. He also fights a terrorist group known as the League of Assassins.

Thirdly, most Batman comics, which aren't just limited to Post-Crisis, depict Bruce as one of the biggest philanthropists in Gotham City because he uses the Wayne Foundation, a subsidiary of Wayne Enterprises, to fund scientific research and provide financial support to victims of crimes that need financial support. Bruce has used Wayne Enterprises to donate money to lots of charitable causes, fund rehab clinics that helps drug addicts break free of their additions, help rebuild Gotham after major disasters, and many more:

Bruce: What I became was beyond your control, Leslie... And perhaps beyond mine. Besides, don't I support this clinic, and others like it? As well as many social programs, under your direction?

Leslie: The Wayne Foundation does, yes...

Source — Detective Comics (1937) Issue #574.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO016

Leslie: -- Exceptional generosity of the Wayne Foundation in funding the free clinic work being done by Doctor Shonda Kinsolving under my supervision...

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #495.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne GyDwPpY9MokxnRBBRuSU1W2-zubfbwAL_nOG3nB6WnzqT1MxmvfDX2R0x851-e5HKUy8J54YYal2=s0

Jim Gordon's internal thoughts: It takes the city a few weeks to calm back down even after Joker is locked safely away in Arkham. His prints aren't in any database, so we'll probably never know who he really is. He's certainly not saying, if he even knows. Wayne was so glad to survive his part in all this that his company rebuilt the Gotham viaduct at no charge. People were sweaty and miserable for a week, and by the end of it water was going for ten bucks a bottle, but we survived.

Source — Batman: The Man Who Laughs.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne MlqeAvafEJBPDPTX2ODSiVgGMprJ-J3kn8ejhy4AuM22aHrw3XuLpQp3vHlvmGOj3oxEO4ywlSnK=s0

Bruce's internal thoughts: An Ethiopian refugee camp just outside Magdala. The misery has returned. Once again the world doesn't listen in time. The same mistakes were repeated. Starvation and death cast a long shadow over this island. The refugees flock into the camps by the thousands each day. It's utterly heartbreaking. When I return to Gotham, I'll send out another check to help the effort and try forget what I've seen here. I'm no different than anyone else. There's only so much even Bruce Wayne -- and Batman -- can do.

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #427.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne IjEDbPfWQNCzTA8WDddmRzXY2dn235XxMzh32NHUualu5hMFWMRihkHFw_oBXCM361zskP7MafDMSJpiszscrFHz5jg4DzWMjSU_RKt8RBuSSLzYjYfq5KI4cR1cC3u2vHrZkTBR3w=s0

You can't just argue that Bruce could do so much more philanthropy than what he already does when it's never actually been quantified how much money he has and how much of it he invests for charity, nor can you argue that he should increase the funding of the GCPD when you don't know much money he provides for the GCPD. Batman stories conspicuously convey that he does a lot of philanthropy. Every single issue of Batman: Hush has Bruce Wayne narrating: "I made a promise on the grave of my parents that I would rid this city of the evil that took their lives. By day, I am Bruce Wayne, billionaire philanthropist. At night, criminals, a cowardly and superstitious lot, call me... Batman." So everything that SJWs think that Bruce should be doing... Is already being done off panel and even shoved down our throats on panel. One of the pivotal story elements of Batman: War on Crime is that Bruce makes Gotham a better place in and out of the cape and cowl; Batman makes Gotham a better place by capturing and locking up criminals, whilst Bruce Wayne makes Gotham a better place by using his wealth and resources to rebuild poor and ruined areas of Gotham. And this isn't the real world, Batman exists in a world with people with superpowers and all kinds of unrealistic people, so trying to apply real world logic to the DC universe is really asinine.

Fourthly, the entire notion that Bruce Wayne could solve Gotham's problems with crime and corruption solely through his wealth is laughable beyond comprehension because throwing money at your problems isn't always going to solve them. If Bruce never became Batman and just remained a billionaire philanthropist, he would get killed by Gotham's mob bosses such as Carmine Falcone, Salvatore Maroni, Penguin, Black Mask, Ventriloquist or even the terrorist group called the League of Assassins. What's Bruce going to do to stop that from happening when there's no Batman around? Bribe them with a check? Criminals will have nothing to be afraid of when there's no Batman around. Bruce Wayne can easily be subdued because he's just a man in the eyes of criminals. Batman on the other hand, can't easily be subdued because he is more than just a man in the eyes of criminals; he's a creature of the night.

One might also ask why Bruce chose to fight crime as a vigilante when he could've worked within the law, given that vigilantism is illegal. The answer to that is that he already tried that, and it just wasn't enough:

Narrator: Bruce entered FBI training. He stayed in it for exactly six weeks. During that time, he'd learned much about writing reports, obeying regulations, analyzing statistics, and dressing neatly... And nothing else. The experience confirmed a suspicion he'd long had: He could not operate within a system. People who caused other people to fall did not recognize systems.

Source — Secret Origins: The Man Who Falls.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO015

Bruce entered FBI training for "exactly six weeks" and "learned much," but left because the experience "confirmed a suspicion" he long had, which was that he couldn't work within legal systems because people "who caused other people to fall did not recognize such systems" i.e. Bruce couldn't work within the law because the law wasn't good enough to stop Gotham from being plagued by organised crime. The law didn't stop Bruce's parents from being murdered in cold blood. As Batman, Bruce is operating outside the law, but as a citizen of Gotham, he didn't have any other viable choice because Gotham's law enforcement was so corrupt, that he couldn't work within the law. The Gotham City Police Department (GCPD), is notorious for being infested with corrupt cops like Arnold Flass that have no qualms about beating people up for no real reason:

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne WBO8uve7c_iG7H5Bi1HqkwGkrxoKlz4Oirv-COwpbb1vaxGt-LRypTJG4ce9Oer5VGF0CEM2Gddq_Y48gATuXhSoUYYqVeoJlNY7rWYB9-pQ6sflbjkDC3W2YPepay6uxJlPmy8IrA=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne MErreoIcF8iYJFYhfwz057ZDJVdnxQT6JEeBaCxYx0l5DEtJ55af-F-rvBru911wke2Jnc0NJh6wYEBNlZSusZBvhxcvqUWjZhi6AarUdl0CRK2gqk13uHz-NoAysoXPnkDx1Di0Ig=s0

The GCPD is so corrupt that the corrupt cops such as Flass, were so uncomfortable with Jim Gordon because he was a good natured cop with high moral standards and refused to allow the GCPD to entice him into giving into their ways. So they all brutally beat him up to put him in his place, but were careful enough to not hurt him so much to be require being hospitalized:

Source — Batman: Year One Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne XiMZfAlthGOhlRjctO0yaPHzB3QQalDZzCEvEXCtAZW5vHhuGBnJaYr98QnY0f1A0i2A9E4QCkfyKeLGbvhuhjvQw3R5kRixTkc_zWf66y7ppXB1BObqC8l0EsGvBCC1XGS7w-Z8Kg=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Om143_NtE-Wu5n-fNiXcDwKw729lTYfCYvz5oYBxIqlQry_LDOw4jZHqejg9DkrILSiKy-SkLJ8-bqEmA3iUMMwVXsbSGKhMrTI1i_M0x-8PuAMLaDxn9oO2yzcVxCYKo10aX8bonA=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 89hr4lYWfpgqKxqaoae63dl-ubCJGP6zjwn8XRwqVfJRhvspnevb9PGvS619YFY8VpjsUkKIT_MF0MjHU68eQO7KvG_8FAgXKYlszjF4SeNFKZokxApPCxCnbFDFjhmjAc6FAHsdWQ=s0

But when Batman began his career, he successfully managed to mitigate crime and corruption in Gotham by removing a lot of corrupt cops and kept Gotham's mob bosses at bay:

Jim: Still, I'm not all that surprised, all the changes Gotham's been through in the last year... Like the Batman trying to wage a one-man war on crime and corruption. Helped me take down a lot of crooked cops and got the mob's hand from around the city's throat. For a while at least. But in the end, no matter how you look at it, the landscape of the city has changed. That Red Hood character a few months back was the first sign. Fool running around in a costume taking down scores. Disappeared the first time he got a look at Batman, though.

Source — Batman: The Man Who Laughs.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 160112613716065344

The reason why Jim Gordon understood Batman and allowed Batman to carry out his crusade was because the law often failed to protect the people of Gotham from organized crime, and it needed someone outside of the law:

Jim: You and I have seen more than our fair share of tragedies and thirsted for revenge. If Batman wanted to be a killer, he could have started long ago. But, it's a line, on one side we believe in the law. On the other... Sometimes, the law fails us. Maybe that's why I understood you... Allowed you to help protect the city.

Source — Batman: Hush Issue #7.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne SgkG6BKP6tCy8XIvFzqU3qWOeYvfStYQ7Ge-fVGxCGJJY0uPqR4y7fDORUUHMOK4pzEPnXwu8OWK=s0

And here is an OOU source confirming that Batman mitigated the suffering in Gotham:

Prologue: New York, New York. The city that never sleeps. Tired-wired citizens too stressed out to care about or connect with anybody but themselves.

A boy named Matt Murdock could go that way... But his boxer-father teaches him to fight past the self-interest trying to T.K.O. his decency. When the mean streets threaten to run down an old man, Matt's training comes to the rescue. That reckless idealism costs Matt his sight... But the accident magnifies his remaining senses. At first, all it means is he feels the pain of his father's murder that much worse. After he brings the killers to hard justice, though, those senses connect him to the world around. They remind him what it means to care.

And it's because he cares, that Daredevil protects his city with such reckless idealism.

Gotham city. Deep skyscraper canyons of vice. Men and Women here suffer just to get by. Or they've found a way to rise above. The privileged Wayne family, out for the night at the movies. A fanciful illusion of light and shadow. Except when the lights finally die at the end of the picture show, all that's left is the darkness. And out of that blackness comes a man and a gun and a double murder that leaves young Bruce Wayne an orphan. Not that he's alone. He has his rage... And the cold obsession it spawns. A mission to drive cowardly, superstitious criminals to their knees and crawling back to the shadows.

Gotham's still no paradise, but the suffering's been eased some. Because now those skyscraper canyons belong to the Batman.

Source — Daredevil/Batman: Eye for an Eye.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne PtASNdpIEp6BO-RS1_e0B1Ai9F51Sh15gl7XD-caI4VDwY05vCIxsZvx0B1Rb5CGXIZJE-JUUyAT=s0

And there are more reasons for why Bruce decided to become a vigilante. Being a vigilante enables Bruce to be anonymous, if he wasn't anonymous, he would be risking attacks on his friends, business associates, company, as well as himself and his only remaining parental figure, Alfred. Many superheroes make themselves anonymous by being vigilantes to safeguard their personal lives and loved ones, it's not exclusive to Batman.

For more evidence of Bruce Wayne's philanthropy, click here for more information.

Is Batman a Hero or Anti-Hero?








A lot of people say that Batman isn't a hero, but an anti-hero. I've seen people argue that Batman is an anti-hero on the basis that he's just a vengeful sociopath with no empathy, but just fuelled by personal vendetta against criminals. This is nonsense and I'm going to quote Alan Grant:

Editor: "He is perhaps the only genuine hero of all of them," Alan Grant says. "People say Batman is this dark, vengeance-driven, obsessed character but that’s not Batman to my eyes. That’s just the fuel which drives Batman. The trauma of his parents’ death is what motivates him and forces him to go on, but what makes him Batman is a decision. He took a decision to be a good guy, which is a decision in life not too many people make. He is a self-made character. He didn’t get superpowers, he’s not a cyborg, he made a choice to be what he is. He is motivated by the terrible thing that happened to him when he was a kid, but that’s not the thing that defines his character. What defines his character is the decision to do something.

Source — Wizard Magazine Issue #46.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Image0

As Alan put it, a lot of people say Batman is just some "dark, vengeance-driven, obsessed character" but that's not who Batman actually is. "That's just the fuel which drives Batman" because the trauma of witnessing his parents' murders "motivates him and forces him go on, but what makes him Batman is a decision" because Bruce "took a decision to be a good guy, which is a decision in life not too many people make" and he is a "self-made character" because of that. He didn't get any superpowers from a radioactive spider like Peter Parker did, nor he is a cyborg like Victor Stone. Bruce "made a choice to be what he is" and although he "is motivated by the terrible thing that happened to him" as a child, it's not what actually defines his character. What defines him as a character "is the decision to do something" i.e. a choice. Alan is damn right, what defines Batman isn't the tragedy that he suffered as a child, it's the fact that he made a choice to remain a good guy after experiencing that tragedy, which isn't a choice that many people take after experiencing tragedy. Many people who experience tragedy, go down a down a path of evil by taking out their pain on other people. Pain can either define you or strengthen you, but the choice is yours. Pain and suffering is a natural part of life, everyone goes through it, but what it all comes down to, is how you deal with that pain because how you deal with it will not only affect you, but will also affect others, for better or worse. Batman has his own commentary on tragedy:

Batman: It is not the moments of tragedy that define our lives so much as the choices we make to deal with them. Marcus chose to walk away from the gun and a life of crime. The life that awaits him will sometimes be hard and sad, but he has proven himself strong enough to face it.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO085

As far as Bruce is concerned, choices are what define an individual, not tragedies. Bruce was only 8 years old when he witnessed his parents' murders, which traumatized him so much that his childhood ended the night. The city that he lived in was infested with murderers, rapists and thieves. The family that he was born and raised in were also among the richest people in Gotham, he could've used his pain, wealth and resources for self indulgent purposes (which he actually pretends to do with the billionaire playboy facade). But he didn't. He used the trauma of his parents' murders to make sure that no one else suffers the trauma that he suffered, and the only way he could've done that is becoming Batman. Trauma is what motivates Bruce to pursue his goal of cleansing the evil that took his parents' lives. Trauma is what motivates Bruce to want to stop other people from suffering how he suffered. Bruce isn't a helpless victim of what happened to him as a child, he's a trauma survivor bringing justice to a city plagued by injustice.

It's no secret that pain can be turned into strength. For generations, novelists and historians have known that many people gather strength from adversity, taking inspiration from their suffering and growing from it. One of the great lessons anyone can learn from pain is the sheer strength of the human spirit. Pain can knock us down and break us, but we can get up and rebuild ourselves into someone even better than who we were before. Pain can also help us become more compassionate and connect to countless others who know what it's like by helping them get back up on their feet. Pain can also help us value and appreciate life despite how dark, depressing, and cruel it can be at times because surviving pain can make us realize how precious life really is.

But like I said, it all comes down to choice i.e. how you decide to cope with that pain, for better or worse. On one hand, You could develop a chip on your shoulder, take out your pain on the world, make others suffer, blame other people and your circumstances for what you are. On the other hand, you could learn something from it and use it to become a better version of yourself. The former may sound easier than the latter, and while the latter isn't by any means a walk in the park, it's much healthier for the human spirit.

But let's get back to talking about the nonsense that Batman is just a vengeful sociopath with no empathy; as Alan himself put it earlier, Batman is fuelled by vengeance, but that's all what it is — the fuel that drives Batman. If Batman was purely fuelled by vengeance, he wouldn't be so obsessed with the impossible goal of trying to make sure that others don't go through what he went through the night his parents were murdered in front of him. He also wouldn't have a moral code. Batman has a moral code because he values life and believes that people deserve second chances, but it's also a method that he uses to restrain his natural instincts and desires for violence and revenge. It really shouldn't be surprising that Batman harbors desires for violence and revenge against Gotham's criminal underworld, he witnessed his parents get brutally murdered by the common criminal when he was only 8 years old, so it's natural for him to have deep rooted feelings of anger and rage towards the kind that took his parents and childhood away from him. But he chose to discipline himself and keep those instincts in check by not being a killer. If Batman was all about vengeance, he'd be a killer, he'd only attacking criminals, he wouldn't bother working with the GCPD, he wouldn't bother trying to protect the innocent. Bruce could've definitely given into his desires for violence and revenge by killing all the criminals and corrupt in Gotham if he didn't have a moral code, but I'll talk about that later because that's a completely separate issue.

Batman isn't a vengeful sociopath with no empathy, at this point it should be obvious that he isn't because I've put a lot of emphasis on his empathy and compassion for the innocent (e.g. traumatized children) and the fact that he doesn't want others to go through the trauma he suffered as a child. Sociopaths are really emotionally stunted, Bruce is not. As a matter of fact, Batman's empathy for traumatized children has actually been exploited by his villains:

Source — Detective Comics Issue #848.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 9L9hYIaUIcrk6hmTj1xnkc8LSJePfMc7T_o71TRDM_LAAKgq0CWtyiORjLeV2Z1E97hLHNTHgPSb2jnmJpetmiVfxDVIxc7ikWBCs8_1BJzpvKMfhY0mW8GyvCgUgxX8Ck-TWw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne IyjSCdypxLp5Tfz10bL2vJ5CKWzgz10OdfUEE2Uu2AsUw-hZTv_YWSjfzPuoDgY6RJQY9K48JLLcQP9x0cgRYe7LadPLePhLRMqbAMz_XZPKp2-F85TgNnAz0wxOor051foC6Q=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 19sw-734IsraC22ULEOAnsP1ynatX4sEc-PYlPahwJ54AFAL0BS2G3D7jxDMglFXJvzQZCCgtMzEYM-p2Wxts0rWNgjPQ1NEU58nUpwfVXT472UUAf9a7ZWpE3n9V_-ZDdR5iQ=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne YECuEqiol5yNL5u5NScEKB96YfeGqK3s06UF3kM-nd8Q9BNpNAPEira21-PQBamciaQxVFn_ef4_EK0KWplKzHb8nd7ecVcDbvT4GuGOyBcEbRBOp-E2rzqPJdc1iLiclvgGGA=s0

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Hu7JOh35p7xDHPUDrma_v3HPH_lbuLpbpV_zbZ_5F9OQzldeXlvy_bde1rssNyP8UCzw7jT70zClN6Mw5_j888nncumhxVn_lJeRZclGD_CScGcKBxcYBoTMcVFhVoqhRRK5iQ=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne -s-CsSgEyst-336WX6in7eU83j1Up36Ia0-RxuwHLvVt0IjkwsTSqeOArhCfFRj3Lpl0E25nMgsfgwpkgmgFD0saG8aDiWdkrvI7d5t_t4lJU3oXhnqebTsL0yrJTFgm2V7_Ew=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Owby--FPEt05iXv1yK-aL6zrNmpc-cGChaSCN3AaCgUoS2LVaC1YqMze0cNERAH8QcmQAJvtTUlYxNHGy6yxari9GXdR4krc0KrI8qnu4RiYJC7BYcoARD7u2auT1TpscBtzaA=s0

Source — Detective Comics Issue #848.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne BQ10uU8D09et0sc-Y4sR4nnKKx16cKaUF1NZK-PWqO4jN4kU5z3jKAiRaLW6EFNLgTq-h0OHEy9Tlsh1WMHJTgAKIsdZiwDqxgvkDi0dg6x0RKNL2O9klP69UcMm97VY8foOkw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne XJe9wrUyCWetZIipK8jQM1VMK1nmTi-y0iQCMm5qb1vQZM-hyd54z5cXaH1223QITEaCFeNOzysfMlC3woTpKxVYgFjQM2m7dMkmNt6thy6-6-EVkTyGu1SokBbpbANwKjtwTw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 2222222222222

Jonathan Crane, the Scarecrow, baits Batman by kidnappping Colin Wilkes, an orphaned child that has a history of mental disturbances. Crane injects Colin with fear toxin, leaves him in a crawl space to make him suffer (knowing that Colin has claustrophobia) and talks about Colin's mental health history as though it amuses him, saying that he should be lobotomized. In response, Batman says: "Only one having his head ripped open tonight will be you" and Crane responds: "Ah, my colleague knows how to get to you. It's children that are your weakness. The little ones, lost and scared. I have often suspected that your origins are similar to theirs. I posed the question to my colleague, brilliant mind, but true to his code name, he always remains mum about certain secrets of yours" which explains why Crane used Colin to lure out Batman. But what makes this situation worse is that when Batman finds where Crane hid Colin, Crane reveals that Colin has a phobia of bats... Which is bad news for Batman because Colin has been exposed to Crane's fear toxin. But what excarberates this situation even more is that Crane activates a dose of venom into Colin... The same venom that Bane uses. Colin briefly goes insane, has a fight with Batman, Batman ends the fight by prompting Colin to attack Crane instead, giving Batman a chance to deactivate the venom that's being pumped into Colin's body. Once that's done, Batman comforts Colin (something a sociopath wouldn't do) and interrogates Crane:

Batman: Why the boy, Crane?

Crane: Like I said, Dr. Elliott knows your weakness. It was all part of his larger plan to distract you.

Batman: Distract me from what? Where is he?

Crane:
Ah. You see, that's the irony. When he said my part involved terrorizing a disturbed child, I tuned out everything else.


Source — Detective Comics Issue #848.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1

It turns out that all of this was just a diversion that Hush AKA Thomas Elliott orchestrated to distract Batman from a master plan that would attack Batman on a personal level:

Source — Detective Comics Issue #848.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne O1pfpIgYk95Z18ywGHCrlFHH-Z4zESNMinqEWTxrvZ37icpDj_7uw43FiyH9LRnot2WiNQkift-8r-cQTDgrcV5V_xDPXOgA4RSk949LkSDoONY4pZGtJ86vJ2YZEF18mBGT1Q=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 9y8Al9whUplpsl2FPcHQrz7AjgdfUbl-c_3MGq8XNjO1IrMyrjSWBs01h37BnJEC_G7fA-16qsmGBRuyRy4dkonrpm3kf7ejD59V4UxOlXLfst6iagGwKaMVrBgOgf5EHVkqmg=s0

This is how the next issue begins:

Source — Detective Comics Issue #849.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 4-3dRVL6GktlzMgemwvOD3GdTVrgQ-Lrr7VAaklFpTaWZzgozshtlo1R1vQEaSkJtX6Bb3yKvN6HPMMfhrCwHqA2xUfOfB9bPC7AAV5KIt-NQEoVVwgw7xFLTvn6D7DusPPAKQ=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Jn9mMZohy2oktuf41gdOTn9ziuyaJS1PS8QtWm-dPyQ0VlsaYCYJCxMXtDtuFCpGJvzI-Rv3SOCQnt2DTaXL-Id0jjyBc5buXvR5Tsr58J8L5FLA6KuEZ_IvxCQ1m9jCRwcoNg=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Y-eiUialOqz2rVUKLTVHB2q7dD-OdOEwB74KwsX2Oo2vkYbI7IUCbhhh2qdr2sXb3Aq5xRMNttcVzQnWPXo7OcWctWY9vhcrLtkziyqJLjLsGOnoiIYJ7BzE8MNCYN7Ou7sH2w=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne SP5mhmXRDDvM1A-Pd8Fn6FEdEgRR-bISUh0TVszPG-v64Nv0PF3N25pXg0tZvbQC9OnxqeUruBLnbmO51tmE2-DcXH_VhhLgYVacti9y2YFfXe1TT46cX-XUBpPh9OxmYkpAtw=s0

When being taken back to Arkham Asylum, Crane gloats about how fun it was to torture Colin and asks a security guard if he has any kids. Batman breaks in, incapacitates the security guards and gives Crane a beating. Note that Crane was already imprisoned and not going anywhere else any time soon. But Batman kicks Crane into the glass of Joker's cell, enters the cell whilst dragging Crane, shoves Joker aside and binds him with cuffs, breaks a lightbulb with exposed wiring, stuffs Crane's head in toilet water whilst electrocuting him at the same time to extract information from Crane, meanwhile Joker can do nothing but watch in awe.

It's ruthless, cruel and brutal, but effective and understandable. Crane is a sick minded sadist who had not only tortured a mentally disturbed kid and gloated about it, but also had information about Hush who literally had Selina's heart, so the fact that Batman took such violent methods to save Selina speaks volumes about how much Batman cares about Selina. Moreover, when Batman does find Hush, Hush has this to say:

Hush: Oh yes, that would be the gas you've been breathing since you entered the room. One part of a binary compound designed to render you immobile but still conscious. I had Colin, the boy you rescued from Scarecrow, exposed to the other part. I knew once Crane's threat was over, you'd hold the traumatized child to calm him. Certainly you carried him to the arriving parademics. Such a gentle heart under that fearsome costume.

Source — Detective Comics Issue #849.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 93Dy0S73uVdJtCHH1mW6Q0Wc0uv08yeClynBLmjjLJtfx-y2KBPYTLvBHEuRq-UjYAd1-mqgrNYKjlfgaj_DgpkEVMYHeSS46sepZuyt0NqCt1ZEOnLcLLNUjifznV-0TFtB9Q=s0

Hush mocks Bruce for having such "a gentle heart under that fearsome costume" because all it took Bruce to be lured out was to kidnap a mentally disturbed child as bait. At the end of the story arc, Batman defeats Hush, and goes to meet the hospitalized Selina to say this:

Bruce: Selina... Tonight I looked into a mirror and saw an ugly distortion of myself. A demon consumed by jealousy and greed. I don't know how to begin to atone for what Elliot did to you. I never wanted you to come to any harm, least of all through me. Hush said that when I saw your heart die, part of mine would die, too. He was right, in a way. There has been only one woman who has really held my heart. I locked that part of myself away after my parents died. It was too hurt to risk exposing again. And yet, despite my best efforts, you broke in. You were the first to touch my heart and remind me I still had one. I don't know if we could ever have more than we've already had. I don't know, especially after this, if you'd want any more from me. Tonight I'm only sure of one thing. Whatever the future holds, wherever life takes me... I will love you always.

Source — Detective Comics Issue #850.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne W2EUJiqpJekP1Wq5oyML9KNAWq0j1WyhZByD7lyqtk1XM_2_uqadqdunsZc_VyDoPtkvQMJ83AUfcgJwY72IjU9KSNLH-9u_WbT-_TXxF6rJzCJMAus5HnTal_E8RvQBeOGjRw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne M5WVh07r9JKrrljK_PYW4TUFKgza_TiMXP3yyuhRJjtePKhEmlagTICDu0lxZ27Y-dhiFtyb0XOjcCrDOhFOnfybMf3yMmDO96KWQm4miFWexofJEXd_5HqJFsEhidgjv9BYbQ=s0

Keep in mind that Bruce didn't know that Selina could actually hear what he was saying to her, which is indicated which is indicated in the next page , so he definitely wasn't trying to manipulate her. This is one of the rare moments that Bruce exhibits his tender side. Bruce is reluctant to get romantically close with other people because he's afraid of losing them just like how he lost his parents; he doesn't want to risk exposing himself to that kind of pain again. This isn't the behaviour of a vengeful sociopath with no empathy. Moreover, Bruce adopted Dick Grayson as his surrogate son because his parents were murdered approximately the same age Bruce was when his parents were murdered, and Bruce wanted to make a difference in Grayson's life:

Bruce: The first person I ever revealed my identity to was Dick Grayson. He was about the same age I was when my parents were killed. His parents -- circus acrobats -- had been murdered. And I... Wanted to make a difference in his life... The way, if my parents had lived, they would have made a difference in mine... Through the years, I've debated whether or not it was fair of me to take him in. Train him. Give him another identity to hide behind. But, I've learned that Dick wasn't like me. He didn't come from a world of privilege. He was a performer. Gifted in that way. And while, at the time, the transition from Robin to Nightwing was... Difficult for us both -- it was a day I had long prepared myself for because... Dick was born to be in the center ring.

Source — Batman: Hush Issue #8.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne SF7AWqieUoDav3SAdaTKjWKER5MVd5J_uhDANKYPdOJpY-dHlfUTrbTCW1H3IxgIKIKAv1_piRnL=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne B_1VFZD5nPDMbz48dKRDUYtsan0_w9lvJ5tURlbyTEXEP-QGajBM5O2QNtuYRJxlcgRDI2UjFNHq=s0

A sociopath wouldn't bother trying to talk a traumatized child out of going down a path of crime:

Batman: Marcus, this isn't you. At least, it doesn't have to be. I saw what happened to your parents. I know what you're feeling. A man with a gun once took away people I loved. I never stopped missing them. Never forgot how painful it was to be alone. You can't bring your parents back, but you can break the cycle of violence that took them. Don't be a part of it, Marcus. Don't become what killed our families.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO078
Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO081

A sociopath wouldn't bother trying to comfort his surrogate son who's grieving over his father's murder:

Source — Identity Crisis Issue #6.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne LNX49lrqg5j_14TbUoVSEjleWpAr-KHG9pSQV5mblJ19B6PcfsONy09GQZ2T28hLoM5T-5l_rUXx=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne B5K4nTYnuG7aWD2Wz-iMLDt3tz8irR8hmvc4lPz3VNvhidwRaO82TvIyFkL79N9P6xuXZc4V05d5=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne BWa_Nnaa_rDQpHNlPW1nQs5iSO2noxRt-kAU8Jnkd2i_xnd__rfChWLwZyURYgETUWyHFfwYuiQQ=s0

A sociopath wouldn't panic over the thought that his butler got kidnapped by Ra's al Ghul:

Source — Batman: Hush Issue #9.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Wj-b2F3OycDRERsp4HtHR-CIIuSEehgeLzyReJZC3_vlwbujasZ_O6zsRscKSrY-MqskPY7z_jlS=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne X-eHrOuPkWiQ8fI2HPnIa6lzJ_GjiID6FXD-ZI5-HXeI_LAaU4NNDtx3SAZB5ZtIpnH5aQtj3khT=s0

A sociopath wouldn't be so anguished over finding out that his surrogate son is dead:

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #428.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne PES_16VX4BoyWi9g2_CvmCukfaGmWwNdXfvYBLbMqRlNpT5zdAO40r0p0tJ7k6UU88L7zYh9XG0d=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne BTSE7er_9HbumH2eHC8taIXBUAx8NvgpDmeMEV2_1ASVzJevrfaAd0eJaz4IhKHzzcYpfdBjgHn3=s0

A sociopath wouldn't share thanksgiving dinner with one of his villains:

Batman: And I shared thanksgiving with someone very... Special.

Grundy:
Solomon Grundy born on a monday!

Source — Batman: The Long Halloween Issue #2.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO020

A sociopath wouldn't bother trying to convince a murderous, psychotic clown to get psychiatric help:

Joker: God damn it... It's empty! Well? What are you waiting for? I shot a defenseless girl. I terrorized an old man. Why don't you kick the hell out of me and get a standing ovation from the public gallery?

Batman: Because I'm doing this one by the book... And because I don't want to. Do you understand? I don't want to hurt you. I don't want either of us to end up killing the other... But we're both running out of alternatives... And we both know it. Maybe it all hinges on tonight. Maybe this is our last chance to sort this bloody mess out. If you don't take it, then we're locked onto a suicide course. Both of us. To the death. It doesn't have to end like that. I don't know what it was that bent your life out of shape, but who knows? Maybe I've been there too. Maybe I can help. We could work together. I could rehabilitate you. You needn't be out there on the edge any more. You needn't be alone. We don't have to kill each other. What do you say?

Joker: No. I'm sorry, but... No. It's too late for that. Far too late. Hahaha. Y'know, it's funny... This situation. It reminds me of a joke...

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Pvg0ymetbin_0cMqZqJYt4WF1z2VnXGf3fv-UuDVy1-Vqqj-8JNaknXo-qbYIoK268Lz2ypIRkmF9nmHZ7tBjZ5Q9n5J-2h-eMBbvru67TgEs9vyD6KcitEBL03HOQ_4ROi_8MM3EQ=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne JndYgl7BWATwidjX9SVG58XK4HpYJK2vCIOsKDAws9LfCsfTfI3KI1UBdYMAGjenzmSnFvtNzwId6bkmoW6vWkGtQsJ7n7LDAdwdr5MiEyz7eJcM7BmhrUukZfeNk3oKyrH7_pcYmQ=s0


The above instance is a really great example of Batman's humanity because it shows that Batman not only sympathizes with traumatized children, but even deranged lunatics like the Joker, despite all the terrible things he has done. The Joker does a lot of terrible things in that story, but is defeated physically and philosophically by Batman. After getting defeated once again, Joker gives up and goads Batman into giving him another beating before handing him the police, but Batman refuses, not just because he abides by certain rules, but because he doesn't want to. He doesn't want to be on some suicide course with the Joker. They're running out of chances and they know it. Batman offers the Joker a chance to fix himself because he knows that something terrible happened to the Joker before he fell into a tank of chemicals. He knows that the Joker experienced some kind of tragedy that tarnished his life, and perhaps Batman has been there too. Perhaps Batman can help the Joker get rehabiliated and regain his sanity, hence why he tells the Joker that he doesn't need to continue being out there on the edge all alone.

Granted, the Joker does reject Batman's offer because he feels like it's too late for that, thinking that whatever hope he had for redemption is long gone, and proceeds to saying that this situation reminds him of a joke, but I'll talk more about that "joke" later. Batman doesn't exactly know what bent the Joker's life out of shape, but he knows that tragedy struck the Joker's life. Batman says that he may have where the Joker was, because tragedy also struck Batman's life, which was when he witnessed his parents' murders. He thinks he can use that to help the Joker to get rehabilitated. It fails, but even in this situation, the Joker seems to exhibit a brief moment of humanity when Batman tries to reach out to him because he apologises for rejecting the offer and even shows a sign of hesitation. A sociopath wouldn't have tried to reach out to the Joker in hope to get him rehabilitated, he would've beaten the crap out him instead.

Granted, there's no denying that as Batman, Bruce does exhibit a harsh and angry side of himself at times, but he only does it to criminals and corrupt law enforcement, people who make Gotham a miserable place for people to live in. But even in that case, he rarely uses excessive force and is careful enough not to seriously harm them, hence why he scolded Jason Todd for shattering a drug dealer's collarbone:

Jason: I had to take him down!

Bruce: You shattered his collarbone! There were at least ten different ways you could have ended that -- none of them had to involve that kind of damage.

Jason: He's a drug dealing pimp. I didn't think I had to fluff up some pillows before I took him out.

Bruce: We needed him. He would have talked. He couldn't talk because he was going into shock from the injuries you inflicted.

Jason: You're right, I'm sorry. That was dumb. But that doesn't mean that he didn't deserve it.


Source — Batman (1940) Issue #645.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne XnIKFYolw78gviGS_R9hA4hUyZqBe2tOzU4riXtEmHtnxSfkAh4zXFtmun_e9Pa0gE3ITYsbZPE8=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne WaeZ027AVwBfd2nt1MQ3SFKlY5y7WxSaRlFWWJpizcT2lVfemSJavYSR63taNEFZ2j_ecQPbLmQ_=s0

Batman is only angry and harsh towards his adversaries because they're scumbags, and he doesn't always beat them up. He's tried to talk Two Face/Harvey Dent out of crime, despite blatantly seeing him working with a team of supervillains mere moments prior:

Batman: You still believe in Gotham city. You were married here. You want to start a family. If nothing else, think of Gilda.

Harvey: Gilda?

Batman: Give me the gun. Harvey.

Two Face: Nice try.

Source — Batman: The Long Halloween Issue #13.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1

So no, Batman isn't an anti-hero. If he were an anti-hero, he would be solely focused on attacking criminals and corrupt law enforcement, he wouldn't be so focused on helping the victims of crime, he wouldn't have a functional relationship with the GCPD, he wouldn't have his own Bat family, and he probably wouldn't be a member of the Justice League.

That's all for part 2. Part 3 will be up next.


Last edited by Latham2000 on April 15th 2021, 2:52 pm; edited 17 times in total
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 21st 2020, 1:00 pm
Message reputation : 100% (7 votes)

Part 3:


Is Bruce Wayne Insane?


Psychology of Bruce Wayne Emmanuel-andrade-batmanlaughs-f

A lot of people have argued that Bruce Wayne is insane just like some of villains and belongs in Arkham Asylum with them. The reasoning for Bruce Wayne being insane is that he witnessed his parents' murders when he was only a kid, as his way of coping with that trauma was wage war against the criminal underworld that took their lives whilst dressing up as a bat.

That may sound superficially true, but this is completely wrong for a number of reasons. To begin with, Bruce Wayne dresses up as a bat is that he wants to feared by criminals. Bruce is also personifying his childhood fear of bats because he fell into a well of bats as a child. Dressing up as a bat isn't exactly normal, but neither is someone who dresses up like an American flag, or someone who dresses wears a red outfit with a double DD on the chest and horns on the head, or someone who wears a red and blue outfit with a big S on the chest. Superheroes who dress in skin tight outfits don't exactly look normal and they're not supposed to look normal. These costumes are an essential element of the vigilante persona that they need to adopt when fighting crime and protecting the innocent, and it's also one of the fantasy elements in comics.

If anything, being Batman prevents Bruce from going crazy in Post Crisis canon, and Grant Morrison's explanation for why Bruce isn't crazy is spot on:

Grant Morrison: I never really subscribed to the idea that Bruce was insane or unhealthy. As I've said before, Bruce Wayne's physical and psychological training regimes (including advanced meditation techniques) would tend to encourage a fairly balanced and healthy personality. Bruce Wayne would have gone mad if he HADN'T dressed as a bat and found a startling way to channel the grief, guilt and helplessness he felt after the death of his parents. Without Batman, Bruce would be truly screwed-up but with Batman he becomes mythic, more than human and genuinely useful to his community. I believe he began to slay his demons the moment he became a demon.

Source — Grant Morrison Tells All About Batman and Robin

Morrison is correct about how important being Batman is to Bruce. As Batman, Bruce had found the ideal method to channel the feelings of anger, rage, grief, guilt and helplessness he felt over the deaths of his parents. As Batman, he can actually make his city a safer place and becomes more than human; he becomes a urban legend. Without Batman, Bruce would be lost because the moment he personified a demon was when he conquered his inner demons. Alfred has stated that the batcave is the only place on earth that Bruce truly feels himself:

Leslie: What's it like down there, Alfred? What does it hold over him?

Alfred: I think, miss Leslie... It may be the only place on earth... That he truly feels himself.

Source — Detective Comics (1937) Issue #575.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne OZANhwixtZK9yH6Idgzuu366lHlA0_IX-X6aiObeTZQZOLQF3ojbevvpqawVyXdfKTNSQua3HN0IWa1Bk0nfUxSF5H0oJc99jY5QkyR-hr6D_hszAEtTy2Xc-Fu8Yu0u_qlFzZjZCQ=s0

This OOU source states the following:

Publisher Synopsis: With only a year’s experience as Gotham City’s new protector, Batman must now confront a nightmare out of the past—a distorted reflection of himself called the Reaper, who hunted Gotham’s criminals a generation earlier. His methods were harsh and cruel, and violent in the extreme. Now, just as a new breed of criminal is rising, the Reaper has returned to deal out his savage brand of justice. And the only way for Batman to stop this death-dealing vigilante is to forge an alliance with the man who destroyed his life—his own parents’ murderer.

But can the Dark Knight stand to confront the secret of their deaths? Or will the Reaper’s revelations finally cost him his sanity?

Source — Batman: Year Two 30th Anniversary Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 16020073439425924

This publisher's synopsis asks the rhetorical question of whether the Grim Reaper's revelations will finally cost Batman's sanity in the story, meaning that Batman isn't insane because he can't be insane if he's at risk of losing his sanity at the hands of a supervillain.

Morrison has also mentioned Bruce uses physical and psychological training regimes, including advanced meditation techniques to maintain a healthy body and mind, which is all true. Bruce learned how to meditate when he sought training from Kirigi during his global quest of seeking the means to fight the injustice that plagued Gotham:

Source — Secret Origins: The Man Who Falls.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO016

Bruce applies this in practise in his alone time to reduce the stress and fatigue that he undergoes as Batman:

Bruce: Been watching the past few nights for them to move. Fighting the exhaustion that wracks me. Meditation takes some of the edge off. Just as Kirigi taught me. So long ago.

Source — Detective Comics (1937) Issue #655.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO003

He even acknowledges that Kirigi had taught him meditation.

Another reason why people have argued that Bruce Wayne is insane is because he is obsessed with the impossible goal of trying rid his city of the evil that took his parents' lives to make sure what had happened to him doesn't happen to others, despite knowing that he will never fully be able to achieve this goal. I disagree with this, Dennis O'Neil explains it best:

Editor: That character is a grim, dark, somewhat obsessed man, driven to fight crime by the memory of his parents' murder. O'Neil notes that Batman can become a bit much, if the wrong elements of his psyche are played up. "I think some writer-artist teams have made the character unappealing, by removing all his humanity. You make him a psycho, as some people have wanted to do, and you have an unappealing character. I think there has to be an essential streak of humanity running through the character and I will always reject the idea that he is a psycho — because I have some ideas about what heroes are and crazy people are not heroes. A hero has to have some control over his own destiny.

But isn't obsession a form of psychosis? O'Neil argues that Bruce Wayne isn't crazy because he recognizes his obsession and uses it for pro-social purposes. "In out sort of psychological picture of Batman, we posit that he knows that he has an obsession — and he's aware of it — but chooses not to fight the obsession because he's an existential man," he points out. "We all need something to give a meaning to our life; with most people it's family, with some people it's job. Most people don't even think about that, they accept what they're handed: Family is the thing that gives meaning to your life and this is the way it's always been. Batman knows he got snared by an obsession and chooses to let that be the governing principle of his life, because he can't think of anything better. At least, it's a very pro-socially useful obsession to have.

Source — Wizard Magazine Issue #4 (1991).

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne BookReaderImages
Psychology of Bruce Wayne BookReaderImages

As O'Neil says, Bruce is an "obsessed man, driven to fight crime by the memory of his parents' murder" which is true, because Wizard Magazine quotes Alan Grant saying that the trauma witnessing his parents' murder "is what motivates him and forces him to go on," because that trauma is essential to Batman's war against organized crime. O-Neil also notes that Batman "can become a bit much, if the wrong elements of his psyche are played up" because some teams of writers-artists have removed Batman's humanity and making him a psycho in that they've made him too violent, which is most likely a reference to Golden Age Batman era. O'Neil nonetheless asserts that there has to be "an essential streak of humanity running through the character" and he also always rejects the idea that Batman is a psycho. O'Neil also states that he has some ideas about what heroes are, and that one of them is that "crazy people are not heroes" in that a "hero has to have some control over his destiny." He also argues that Bruce isn't crazy because "he recognizes his obsession and uses it for pro-social purposes" i.e. protecting the innocent and apprehending the perpetrators that prey on the innocent. He also notes that Batman's psychological picture entails that Bruce "knows he has an obsession" but chooses not to fight that obsession "because he's an existential man" i.e. his obsession with protecting the innocent and apprehending the perpetrators is what gives his life meaning. O'Neil expands upon this by saying that we "all need something to give meaning to our life" and mentions that family and jobs gives meaning to certain people's lives, saying that Bruce knows that "he got snared by an obsession and chooses to let that be the governing principle of his life, because he can't think of anything better" which is true because there was no other way that Bruce could save Gotham from being destroyed; operating outside the law as Batman was the only answer to organized crime, hence why O'Neil says that "it's a very pro-socially useful obsession to have" and I've already proven that Batman makes Gotham a better place.

Granted, one can argue that Bruce's obsession with an impossible goal is foolish because he's never going to be able to fully succeed, parents will still be murdered and children will still become orphans, there's only so much one man can do to help a corrupt city, but I don't think think that's a sign of insanity. Bruce has actually illustrated to Leslie Thompkins that many people aren't that different from him when it comes to that mindset:

Leslie: You never mentioned any of this in your letters. It sounds awful -- weren't you lonely?

Bruce: I don't know. If I was, it doesn't matter. I liked those times. In those days, I really thought I could make a difference...

Leslie: You don't know?

Bruce: Sometimes, no.

Leslie: Then why do you do it, Bruce?

Bruce:
Why do you run this clinic, Leslie? Why do you patch up street gangs like rag dolls, knowing they'll be back tomorrow? Why do you treat addicts, knowing they'll float back in next week, lost in some newer, deadlier drug?

Leslie
: Be... Because I have to.

Bruce:
I know.

Source — Detective Comics (1937) Issue #574.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO020

He also talks about it here:

Bruce: I know I am fighting a war I can never completely win. But there are small victories that encourage me to keep trying. If I can win back one child, there may be hope for many others. If it starts with one person, and then a neighborhood, then perhaps redemption can spread through an entire city, and finally back to me. I helped Marcus deal with his pain. It will take him some time, but I know it will eventually leave him. Maybe someday I'll feel I can leave mine behind as well. But for now I still wait.

Source — Batman: War on Crime.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO090
Psychology of Bruce Wayne RCO093

He admits that he's fighting a war he'll never completely win, but there are small victories that encourage him to keep trying. If he can help one person, it's a sign that others can be helped, from one person to a neighborhood, to perhaps an entire city, and finally back to himself, then maybe he can finally heal from the trauma of his parents' murders. Speaking of healing, another reason why people have argued that he's insane is because he relives his parents' murders every night. Millerverse Batman has even mentioned it:

Batman: It's a 45 caliber bullet. Hollow point. It explodes in his chest. I feel the shock through his fingers. For the hundred thousandth time -- my father dies.

Source — The Dark Knight Returns Issue #3.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 8FExxhV45tz2MmqGVdCppBMTiYD95NfT35Tc08sv7g9pgRsG7lq4O7jAxxVrx5FTgC5-c63DVjU1=s0

Millerverse Batman in this story is 55 years old, and he says that he sees his father die for "the hundred thousandth time" in his internal thoughts. It could be a hyperbole, but it reinforces the subtext that he relives his parents' murders on a nightly basis. Bruce doesn't want to heal from the trauma of his parents' murders, Wizard Magazine quotes Dennis O'Neil saying that Bruce is "driven to fight crime by the memory of his parents' murder" and Alan Grant saying "the trauma of his parents' death is what motivates him and forces him to go on" as Batman. As Batman, Bruce found the ideal method to channel the feelings of anger, rage, grief, guilt and helplessness he felt over his parents' murders into a symbol of justice that protects his city. Granted, this definitely isn't the ideal choice of a coping mechanism for chronic grief in the real world, counselling is definitely a much better option, but Batman doesn't exist in the real world, nor is it humanly possible to be like Batman, even far weaker versions of Batman such as Burtonverse and Nolanverse Batman are superhuman by real world standards. The reason why Batman isn't insane despite reliving his parents' murder on a nightly basis is because he meditates and exercises a lot.

his isn't to say that Batman is completely immune to mental illness, but who is? He's human. Yeah a lot of what he has done is superhuman by real world standards, but he's far from invincible. Superheroes aren't invincible, one of the reasons why characters like Superman, Batman, Spider-Man and various others appeal to so many people is because they have human qualities. They're flawed, vulnerable and fail from time to time. Batman has mental scars that have been exploited by his villains e.g. Scarecrow and Hugo Strange, but that's nothing uncommon because human beings are imperfect, many people bear mental scars and inner demons, that doesn't necessarily mean they're crazy. There's a fine line between being on the edge and having gone over the edge. Batman is on the edge sometimes, but he's definitely not gone over the edge. If he was crazy, he wouldn't be affected by Scarecrow's fear toxin or any other hallucinating induced drugs. Keep in mind that Scarecrow's fear toxin doesn't affect the Joker because he's crazy, but does affect Batman.

Batman at times can be stubborn, cold, paranoid and obsessive to the point he can be perceived as unlikeable and self destructive e.g. developing contigency plans for the scenario of an out of control Justice League without telling them, but does that mean that he is bad at being a hero? No, it fucking doesn't. It's a very dishonest, reductive oversimplifcation of his moral character because it's contingent on the notion that his character is defined by his flaws and the bad things he's done. If we're going to go by the 2 digit IQ level logic that Batman is not a good hero because Ra's Al Ghul stole and exploited Batman's contingency plans for the scenario of an out of control Justice League, then by that logic, Cyclops would be a terrible hero because of what he did in Avengers vs X-Men, and that Ironman, Mr Fantastic and Dr Strange would terrible heroes for sending the Hulk into outer space, and Ironman would especially be a terrible hero for being a villain in the Civil War event. But no one is going to accept logic that unless they want to be consistent. Why? Because it's such a braindead logic to argue that these guys are incompetent heroes for doing bad things and it's a reductive oversimplification of their character as a whole. Batman has blatantly done a lot of good things and there's a reason why he's regarded as one of the greatest superheroes ever. Many superheroes have done bad things, Batman isn't the only one.

Batman's Rogues Gallery


Psychology of Bruce Wayne 7734419-1481242965-4-1Ap

One of the best things about Batman is his rogues gallery because they're diverse in that they challenge Batman in different ways, their back stories and character motivations are interesting and well written, barring a few such as Hush. They're also very psychologically scarred:

Dan DiDio: One of the most enduring things about Batman is his rogues gallery; the villains, because as I'd like to say, the rogues define the hero. The greater the threat, the greater the hero.

Narrator: Demonstrating everything from psychopathology to narcissism, Batman's arch enemies also offer twisted mirror images of Batman himself.

Benjamin Karney: His villains, like Batman, experienced a tragedy,
but he responded by saying "I'm going to spend my life restoring justice to the world." His villains don't make that choice.

Danny Fingeroth:
There are plenty of villains that are just as obsessed, but they feel if anything bad happened to them is something they need to get payback from the world from, whereas Batman had the exact opposite point of view: "Something bad happened to me, I'm going to make sure it never happens to anybody else."

Dan DiDio:
Every one of the villains takes what Batman uses as a strength, and makes it a weakness; so therefore, Batman sees how his methodologies can go horribly wrong if he goes over a certain line. Penguin is bureaucracy gone bad, if Batman or Bruce Wayne let his foundation be used immorally, he could become what Penguin is.

Source ― Batman Unmasked: The Psychology of the Dark Knight.



OK, I will have to point out that I don't completely agree with the commentary above, I think it's very exaggerated because not all of Batman's villains "takes what Batman uses as a strength" and turn it into a weakness. Ra's al Ghul, Killer Croc, Clay Face, Black Mask, Poison Ivy, Mad Hatter and various others have very little in common with Batman. Not every one of Batman's villains experienced tragedy, some did, but not all of them did. And even in that case, I think the idea that Batman's villains are darker reflections of himself on the basis that they experienced tragedy but chose a different path can be said about pretty much every superhero and their rogues gallery (and pretty much all heroes and villains in general), which not only takes away what makes these villains great, it's also a reductive because it's not what defines these villains. Yeah, there are a handful of Batman villains that have one or two similarities with Batman.

Harvey Dent/Two-Face has a dual identity much like how Batman has a dual identity of being Batman and Bruce Wayne, but that's a very minor similarity because Dent has split personality disorder, whereas Batman only uses Bruce Wayne as a disguise, so they're still different in that regard.

Jonathan Crane AKA Scarecrow uses fear as weapon by personifying his childhood fear of scarecrows much like how Batman uses fear as weapon by personifying his childhood fear of bats, but that's also a minor similarity because Crane lives off fear as some kind of fetish, whereas Batman uses fear against criminals because because they're superstitious cowards, so they're still different in that regard.

Edward Nygma AKA Riddler uses his high intellect to commit crimes much like how Batman uses his intellect in his war against crime, but that's also minor because Nyma is narcissistic and uses his intellect for riddles, whereas Batman uses his intellect for detective work and psychoanalysis on his adversaries, so they're still different in that regard.

Oswald Cobblepot AKA Penguin is a wealthy businessman who owns casinos and nightclubs much like how Batman is a wealthy businessman as CEO of Wayne Enterprises, but that's a minor similarity because Cobblepot uses his wealth to commit crimes, whereas Batman uses his wealth to fight crime and protect the innocent.

I think the idea that Batman's villains are darker reflections of him only really applies to the Joker because he is the antithesis of Batman. Batman is quiet, serious and grim; Joker is loud, happy and wisecracking. Batman values life; Joker is a mass murderer. Batman is about order and justice; Joker is about chaos and madness. But that in itself is not the reason why Joker is a darker reflection of Batman; both Batman and Joker a bad day once, losing their loved ones, but they chose different paths in the aftermath of their one bad day. We all know Batman's origin story, it's been told and retold many times and remains largely the same, but I've not talked about Joker's origin story, so now I'm going to talk about The Killing Joke because it shows us what kind of man the Joker once was. Here's how it starts:

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Ij831v6NAj2FDBK0XWmOUJj4olqZXDsArLetYmYtbRtUExELE2nE3rc_CHEF7sidR5s4U9NlDUp7zeLwhq_yeHSuzpYY3dDZ6SbXidlj4PctUOIppJujiJe3BMHiLxqVISIgztuc3g=s0

Then this happens:

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne UwH8Fgee0008WnFAQBkIdAKPpXQo7GNJReQK1yDnxr3vcjDVIb7N5hu4TjVgoNGP5Eyxj0PDfBz452t_AXcS7MlQP5hRr1ZRfzzEHjNJPkscP9lGvCw_NPoGLjbl4RyqIjPZczmHzw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 160250929492419475

Then this happens:

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 160250929492419475
Psychology of Bruce Wayne OgMrWbpO0UjhrvlBNPuiVXfg0uHzpZEckHF1874J62rMNP8GBdOSD511uz8DUFVqYpbZSxf6Iyt605m3nvWaZ_NLu0DovCP3VOA1h23Uj48Ca5-sHRUofOWX3uESz5hE3MXY7juKPQ=s0

Then this happens:

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne RLzi_imDiyjgkLNnFLUiJXETwrL-zjU3azS052nHXRNZF-QlQR14j1a3bPTvrJomKVaSGNcrnfhCxMV7Nl6a2jEQyKWsmcsweY5yb9SQ5wPt1Mf8T4isaQm8OAyGkE8TVq9YZr_fcw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne P1XIWPKHlNvV8ajFSBy-HaGswMwPY5yfiMhgBDlNtifmZYQiwJmasae6HDx1hnBYfE7X2Ajt6jqKNjsVwHSVnTkDrnIF79IhwIL5lSnzPEkSGrWXla0NYR2RPjygjUB-dxj1BE6HLw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne JlckPkDm_vrCW3kPLk5SyWfNYFzIZUKjnxLBmnblEzgA9VSp8mcwYtSgCaiPVbRTIjnhAg7FrS4HT00mV3kEM7m8kNhQHbb8SGajB7W7Spgaim1qeG76xAiWG8xNVuSVNOAYBD5Kwg=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne UgivJ6FvelzZ9oWWOuXr2ibAJoy1V-paJMSwzOwdtLdxdM9zZXQ57GdJbL2g71eN4MvJ7wNwegMyEQrU2GNssemA3JS30mbX_90gsG3RNH0Nk8SkuhvDm-jY8nUORe-uHHr3bN9-6w=s0

In summary, the Joker — who I will just refer to as Jack — was once just a normal man with a pregnant wife; a mild-mannered former lab assistant who quit his job at a chemical plant to pursue his dream of becoming a stand up comedian. But his career as a comedian fails miserably, and with a baby on the way, as well as a desperate need for money, he resorts to crime to provide for his wife and unborn child by agreeing to guide two gangsters through  the chemical plant he previously worked at so that they can rob the playing card company next to it. The gangsters had a history of using different people to help them rob many places, each time having them wear the helmet of the infamous Red Hood so the police focus on the idea of one master criminal. During the planning, the police inform Jack that his wife and unborn child died in a household accident. Overwhelmed by grief, Jack tries to withdraw from the plan, knowing that it's pointless because his wife and unborn child are dead, but the gangsters coerce him into keeping his commitment to them. When they arrive at the chemical plant, the gangsters make Jack wear the mask of the Red Hood, but when they go inside, their plan goes horribly wrong because the gangsters get killed by unexpected security guards. Jack however, is confronted by Batman.

Batman tries to apprehend Jack with the mistaken assumption he's the same Red Hood he's met before, but Jack panics and jumps into a lake to evade being captured by Batman. Jack survives, but what he doesn't initially realize is that the lake he jumped into was contaminated by chemicals, so when he emerges from the lake to look at his own reflection, he discovers the horror that the chemicals have disfigured his face, and he snaps. The grief over the deaths of his wife and unborn child, compounded by the realization that he's been disfigured, causes Jack to snap, thus marking the birth of the Joker. This scene is adapted well in The Killing Joke animated movie adaptation:



That being said, this backstory could be false because the Joker himself says "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another... If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!" during a speech to Batman, but it's still very likely and it's not outside the realm of possibility that his backstory became repressed memories. Speaking of that speech, it just so happens to be one of the most best scenes of The Killing Joke because it has a very deep philosophical meaning about the nature of life:

Joker: So, I see you received the free ticket I sent you. I'm glad. I did so want you to be here. You see, it doesn't matter if you catch me and send me back to the Asylum. Gordon's been driven mad. I've proved my point. I've demonstrated there's no difference between me and everyone else! All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day. You had a bad day once, am I right? I know I am. I can tell. You had a bad day and everything changed. Why else would you dress up as a flying rat? You had a bad day, and it drove you as crazy as everybody else... Only you won't admit it! You have to keep pretending that life makes sense, that there's some point to all this struggling! God you make me want to puke. I mean, what is it with you? What made you what you are? Girlfriend killed by the mob, maybe? Brother carved up by some mugger? Something like that, I bet. Something like that... Something like that happened to me, you know. I... I'm not exactly sure what it was. Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another... If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice! Ha ha ha! But my point is... My point is, I went crazy. When I saw what a black, awful joke the world was, I went crazy as a coot! I admit it! Why can't you? I mean, you're not unintelligent! You must see the reality of the situation. Do you know how many times we've come close to world war three over a flock of geese on a computer screen? Do you know what triggered the last world war? An argument over how many telegraph poles Germany owed its war debt creditors! Telegraph poles! HA HA HA HA HA! It's all a joke! Everything anybody ever valued or struggled for... It's all a monstrous, demented gag! So why can't you see the funny side? Why aren't you laughing?

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne NHCC3uzko0lSREb2yilW_cjmrYG5pwY1Met4nX60jQqHZiCf1pEUE1lfVArfw3ACA1YMMMRa1mqJSWn_ZQfEvh0PQ5KZxNGquQB64eBr5NG9WkFCiHB4teDYB5WOjkXjWZKfyXJrsA=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne O7h7ZCnsI2G_tAAw5eOzA5aoGSZakUxQbk_ij6X9qtvQwvozwwC67DjB1V2AFg46W_XtrIPRtwc7s7vEe49lxz3P-_QiYsRKPAF8iaqn_fpYnQOWJA5bCuf21N32-WqKpYzgRJwvQA=s0

This fan made voice over captures the speech perfectly:



The Killing Joke animated movie adaptation doesn't capture the speech as well as it should have, but the animation and voice acting makes it worth watching:



This speech alone is one of the reasons why The Killing Joke is one of the greatest Batman stories of all time. In this speech, the Joker makes reference to his cruel deeds to drive Jim Gordon insane to prove something about human nature; that "one bad day" is all what it takes for anyone to over the edge and turn into a monster like the Joker himself. The Joker doesn't know who Batman is under the cape and cowl, but he can tell that Batman himself had a bad day once, thinking that it turned Batman insane as everyone else. He hates Batman's worldview because he can't fathom how Batman believes that life makes sense and that there's something worthwhile about living decently in a cruel world where horrible things happen all the time for no reason at all. He doesn't know what happened to Batman, but he does know that something happened and makes speculative remarks about what happened to Batman, because something like that happened to the Joker himself. What might have been the case was that the Joker was once a jobless, failed comedian whose wife and unborn child were killed in a fire before he fell into a lake of acid. The Joker accepts his lunacy, but is confused about why Batman doesn't accept because he thinks Batman is pretending that the world makes sense. He brings up what he thinks caused the second world war to illustrate not only how violently petty the world is, but that it's a joke, that anything anyone ever valued and struggled for, is ultimately "just a monstrous demented gag" because the world is such a horrible place. But what makes the Joker so frustrated and sad is that Batman doesn't "see the funny side" because he doesn't laugh at the joke that the Joker thinks the world is.

That being said, the Joker's entire speech is well written and very insightful... But that isn't to say that he's right. His speech is just a bunch of half truths that only edgelords or nihilists would agree with. Here's Batman's response:

Batman: Because I've heard it before... And it wasn't funny the first time. Incidentally, I spoke to Commissioner Gordon before I came in here. He's fine. Despite all your sick, vicious little games, he's as sane as he ever was. So maybe ordinary people don't always crack. Maybe there isn't any need to crawl under a rock with all the other slimy things when trouble hits. Maybe it was just you, all the time.

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne YfTZQBgVfBxPukWc8vmw6txzeKmDgmWsBKOxPBfD5mabs54IE6FCSLwqFFJQ4V5YojWvqFMEgUuMyPnjmcczfjKFcdmrJJfIzee2UAGg7i9Ndf3iWQndih0BRAatb9_A1AGC54YtNA=s0

Batman, in response, doesn't laugh because he's heard the joke before. This isn't the first time that someone has tried to manipulate Batman into thinking that his war against organized crime is futile, nor is it the first time he's heard someone say that the world will always be a terrible, dark place regardless of what he does to remedy it. And to illustrate how wrong the Joker's view on human nature and morality are, Batman mentions that Commissioner Gordon didn't snap when being tortured by the Joker's cruel and sick antics, proving him wrong about human beings during their bad days. Batman refutes the Joker's entire argument by forcing him to face the reality that not everyone becomes a monster than tragedy strikes, and that the Joker was cowardly to face his problems head on. Batman didn't snap when tragedy struck his life as Bruce Wayne, he made the choice to use his pain to help others by pursuing the goal of purging his city of crime and corruption so that no one else has to live through the tragedy that Bruce Wayne went through as a child. This is in stark contrast to the Joker becoming a homicidal madman after getting his face disfigured and losing his wife and unborn child. Batman has the makings of a villain. It would be so easy for him to spiral down into the evil that he faces, but he doesn't.

Of course, Joker gets so salty about this, that he just tries to kill Batman, but gets his ass kicked as usual, continuing like this:

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 6lkEirN-1YzP4GwBb8_vYR6ZOg_Z69itXKqAv-wVn9ZogtfwYdvirvEifpv2SwJmQXuCKpB9m876IIzO6PVaViIjNwDn6rLXXN5N54-4HF1JkYTUmelJcR0_VxvJNaZ13Xd_HyJF7Q=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne Pvg0ymetbin_0cMqZqJYt4WF1z2VnXGf3fv-UuDVy1-Vqqj-8JNaknXo-qbYIoK268Lz2ypIRkmF9nmHZ7tBjZ5Q9n5J-2h-eMBbvru67TgEs9vyD6KcitEBL03HOQ_4ROi_8MM3EQ=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne JndYgl7BWATwidjX9SVG58XK4HpYJK2vCIOsKDAws9LfCsfTfI3KI1UBdYMAGjenzmSnFvtNzwId6bkmoW6vWkGtQsJ7n7LDAdwdr5MiEyz7eJcM7BmhrUukZfeNk3oKyrH7_pcYmQ=s0

I talked about this specific scene earlier; Batman offers to rehabilitate the Joker, but his offer is rejected because the Joker believes whatever chance of redemption he had is long gone. But what I didn't talk about was the joke that he told:

Joker: See, there were these two guys in a lunatic asylum... And one night, one night they decide they don't like living in an asylum any more. They decide they're going to escape. So, like, they get up onto the roof, and there, just across this narrow gap, they see the rooftops of the town, stretching away in the moonlight... Stretching away to freedom. Now, the first guy, he jumps right across with no problem. But his friend, his friend daredn't make the leap. Y'see... Y'see, he's afraid of falling. So then, the first guy has an idea... He says, "Hey! I have my flashlight with me! I'll shine it across the gap between the buildings. You can walk along the beam and join me!" B-but the second guy just shakes his head. He suh-says... He says "What do you think I am? Crazy? You'd turn it off when I was half way across!"

Source — Batman: The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Mmk4iqJ0dwoijo55NJ10dvAn32Eh9eyVLhi44Zei_Jjdx3PhUOHQwCxnitw1vhqU1b6cyoWjfXsOkx3k6g356r9BZcgcK2DHKnQgFKaR7txiNSixwiGSeY-BUxfNSF0w2dEW6I0e_Q=s0

The joke itself is a metaphor for how the Joker perceives his relationship with Batman. The two men are Batman the Joker, deemed unfit to be accepted by society, they want to break free of society's chains. Batman is the man who jumped the gap first, the Joker is the man who is too scared to jump. Batman was able to make the jump because he's not afraid, Joker didn't make the jump because he's afraid that he'll fall. The first man using a flashlight beam to help the second man is foolish because a flashlight beam isn't going to do anything to help, just like how Batman can't do anything to get the Joker rehabilitated. But the real joke isn't that the second man rejects the first man's flashlight beam because it's foolish, it's that the second man doesn't trust the first man's flashlight beam because he's afraid that it will turn off halfway through, which is a metaphor for Joker not trusting Batman because he's afraid that Batman will give up on him. In other words, the Joker is saying that he doesn't trust Batman's offer of rehabilitation because he is afraid that Batman will only give up on him before the rehabilitation can even begin to succeed.

After the joke is told, this happens:

Source — The Killing Joke Deluxe Edition.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne HKN-cMjxpr-wcjsqQNyoFmgjq_48kr6au2RCqwdaQ7LQLlnvZXrH9H3pmid3mXx-LbyJT5k7kuHJElFXKYZMzdDRcLMsrxQlsgGNCspoNPX0vSM5oyEBSH5xAJ8M1jXfdtjU4xAEsA=s0

The Joker laughs at his own joke, and Batman also laughs. They share a laugh over the sheer joke that is their nigh suicidal relationship before Batman hands over the Joker to the police. No, Batman doesn't kill the Joker by snapping his neck, all he does is grab the Joker's shoulders to bring him to the incoming GCPD cars so that they can take him back to Arkham Asylum, that's why the laughter abruptly stops and why there are nearby lights. The official script of the comic confirms the presence of incoming police and actually says: "He and the Joker are going to kill each other one day. It's preordained. They may as well enjoy this one rare moment of contact while it lasts." Which heavily implies that Batman does not kill the Joker, only that they will eventually die at each other's hand in the eventual future. The events of The Killing Joke are also repeatedly referenced in many Post Crisis Batman stories that take place later on... And the Joker is still alive, so the theory automatically self-destructs on that basis. The animated movie adaptation captures the scene almost perfectly:



The only problems are some of the dialogue is unnecessarily trimmed down and there's no sign of the GCPD arriving.

Batman's Moral Code


Psychology of Bruce Wayne XhptCT_3qcUGDTHr9JsvZvebEiT-KC5KnCsEx5bc1vq3fQ5QFdtslJTGmUd24IxfQsAXmaiNc7rjNWPco1DPRHpbTElINvZsroo0QY3Iqk1rFrQ4fVwXk8hOo0vx_iEEUg0KqmLu6g=s0

One of the most important elements of Batman's character is that he has a moral code i.e. no killing and no guns, which is part of what makes him a very psychologically fascinating character. I am not going to comment about what I think whether Batman's moral code is right or wrong, I'm just going to explain why he has it. A lot of people bitch and moan about Batman's moral code all the time even though Batman isn't the only superhero who refuses to kill because Spider-Man, Daredevil, Superman and the Flash (Barry Allen) are also against killing, but I've never seen anyone ask why Spider-Man doesn't kill the Green Goblin or Carnage for example. Perhaps they would prefer Batman being more like the Punisher. There are many reasons why Batman has a moral code. These reasons are primarily psychological. Batman has a no guns rule because a man with a gun killed his parents, so he naturally harbors a lot of hatred for guns. As for his no kill rule, he explains it to the Joker:

Joker: Will you do it? Kill me? Release the burden that torments both of us?

Batman:
No. Oh, I want to -- I've never wanted anything so much. But I won't. Because if I did, I'd be violating a belief that has sustained me all these years. I believe in the absolute sacredness of human life. I may not really believe in anything else. There's more. If I did as you ask, I'd be no better than my enemies -- I'd be the insane avenger some people are certain I already am.

Source — Legends of the Dark Knight Annual #1.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 9PXbai9aCD8JuhD5BZob0aBRWkuM4reOyL21ff3V6-rqQzH-Ng40Btlm1ZG11G-X6PRR5bSvsu_zkdGzXuX6DRLaeeUhRrS5kFiQCz2G_soCMXY2vjpdy2CQcEwUqkOAkaklvw=s0

As explained in the scan above, Batman has a moral code because he believes in "the absolute sacredness of human life." Life is sacred to Batman because he has witnessed the power of taking a life when he saw Joe Chill murder his parents, and he doesn't want to become the kind of man that killed his parents. Anyone can take a life if they really wanted to, but the sheer ramifications of taking a life is so monumental, and Batman knows this with every fiber of his being. What also makes life so sacred to Batman is that he believes in second chances and redemption. That's why he apprehends criminals rather than just killing them. Apprehending them gives them a chance to rethink their lives and turn away from a life of crime. Not all criminals in Gotham are homicidal psychopaths, some criminals commit petty crimes because they're desperate and crime is the only way they can get money because Gotham is that corrupt. So to Batman, there's always a chance they could get reformed. Not only does taking away the life of a criminal take away any chance of redemption, it could also impact the lives of other people because some criminals have people that love them i.e. family. Robbing them of the person they care about is going to cause them the same pain that Batman went through as a child. One of the ways that Batman fights crime as Bruce Wayne is that he tries to help criminals get reformed as Bruce Wayne by using the Wayne Foundation to address the social issues that encourage crime in Gotham, so he doesn't just put them behind bars to help them get reformed.

Another good instance of Batman explaining his moral code is when a resurrected Jason Todd tries to entice Batman into killing the Joker:

Bruce: You don't understand. I don't think you ever did.

Jason: What? Your moral code just won't allow for that? It's too hard to "cross that line"?

Bruce: No. God almighty... No. It'd be too damned easy. All I have ever wanted to do is kill him. For years a day hasn't gone by where I haven't envisioned taking him... Taking him and spending an entire month putting him through the most horrendous, mind boggling forms of torture. All of it building to an end with him broken, butchered and maimed... Pleasing -- screaming -- in the worst kind of agony as he careens into a monstrous death. I want him dead -- maybe more than I've ever wanted anything. But if I do that, if I allow myself to go down into that place... I'll never come back.

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #650.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne EVb-awPjmcrjGgb18iElPfoCKd3Tr89P8U3xLVob5B82gYiBlfGgtxx251QCihigzunOzJfCdsQd=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne AU1c-fkpuotnUH3EWYuQpi449r-esnJfet-8kKssaZ5hn-iRCWPVCYyqe14lefgLULJrLuHCrV-j=s0



As Batman says here, it would just be "too damned easy" to kill. He's worried that he might not be able to stop killing if he goes down the path of being an executioner. Part of what motivates Batman to fight crime is a desire for vengeance. He witnessed his parents get brutally murdered by a man with a gun when he was only 8 years old, so he has deep rooted feelings of anger and rage towards the criminal underworld for taking his parents and childhood away from him. Batman uses a strict moral code to control and restrain his desires for violence and revenge. Self discipline is one of Batman's most defining traits. Self discipline is why he follows his moral code very strictly. Alfred has even made a remark on it:

Dick: Besides, what's the use of keeping my strength up? Bruce has probably already put out a want ad for a new partner!

Alfred: That's hardly fair, master Dick. His foremost concern is for your welfare.

Dick: Aw, I know. It's just that he's so -- so darn tough!

Alfred:
He's more strict with himself than with anyone else.

Source — Batman: Full Circle.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne MlzIGiAXp81kiy35rBKR2iNUjzy7G5ZZXh6bwRDz6we08Hz6pj3llMITJRp8FbBN7q94fRPDWyXG=s0

Alfred describes Bruce as being "more strict with himself than with anyone else" to Dick Grayson in a conversation about why Bruce forced Dick to stay at home whilst Bruce is out as Batman.

Granted, these aforementioned reasons for Batman's moral code are psychological driven, but they're not the only reasons why Batman has a moral code. Batman's moral code are one of the only reasons why the GCPD permit his crusade against crime:

Batman: I don't kill, Zsasz.

Zsasz: Ah yes, your "saving grace" -- the one factor that allows the zombies to sanction your actions... That and your choice of victims of course. But you'd like to kill them, if only they'd let you get away with it... Because it would make your work so much easier, wouldn't it?... And ever so much more satisfying.

Source — Batman (1940) Issue #493.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne E-rASnQWTmKF36CsXxh7vF-nLQ0Oo_Z4xIKcc3SlJjTXpgWxvcWigN_aRDPH7g7Ykf1bwuIL1gjSurla3glQY7gU9gHbbY561Wy2tvaBHKE3ZgcpdKncI1tjcrlpeZ9bfeUlqotZzQ=s0

Batman is already breaking the law by simply being a vigilante, but the GCPD still permit him to operate because they need him. The reasons why they approve of Batman's crusade against organised crime are that he specifically targets criminals and doesn't kill them. Jim Gordon would never approve of Batman if he was an executioner. If Batman didn't have a moral code, Jim Gordon would condemn him and lead the entire GCPD to apprehend him, and he's more than capable of deducing Batman is Bruce Wayne because deep down, Jim already knows who Batman is. It would take nothing more than 20 minutes of honest detective work to confirm his suspicion that Batman is Bruce Wayne, the only reason why he hasn't is because he doesn't care. Jim respects Batman's privacy because they're friends, and Batman's secret identity doesn't matter to Jim because it's irrelevant, what's matters to Jim is that Gotham is salvageable.

Of course, one could still argue that even superheroes like Batman should make exceptions to their no kill rules because certain people just can't be reformed, such as the Joker. Part of why so many people give Batman a lot of heat for his moral code is that he refuses to kill the Joker because he's too dangerous to be kept alive, but what these people forget is that even Batman has made the Joker an exception at least twice. Batman has tried to kill the Joker in A Death in the Family and Batman: Hush, but several people stopped him. In the former instance, Batman tries to kill the Joker for murdering Jason Todd, but gets stopped. In the latter instance, Batman tries to kill the Joker for seemingly murdering Thomas Elliott (among other things), but also gets stopped. I'm not going to explain everything in those situations in full detail, just read the stories themselves. The latter instance of Batman trying to kill the Joker has been posted on YouTube, with great voice over:



I don't want to delve too much into the "should Batman kill the Joker?" shenanigans because that's ultimately just another tiresome discussion on moral issues. Killing the Joker isn't even contingent on Batman breaking his moral code because there are other people who could also do it. Perhaps Jim Gordon should do it. He's a cop, he has killed people, he is among the people who have been affected the most by the Joker's atrocities, and yet he never gets any heat for this. As for those who would prefer a Batman to be more like the Punisher, he does exist.

That's all for part 3. Part 4 will be up next.


Last edited by Latham2000 on April 15th 2021, 3:49 pm; edited 32 times in total
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 21st 2020, 1:00 pm
Message reputation : 100% (7 votes)

Part 4:


Batman Without the Moral Codes


Psychology of Bruce Wayne BMWLTGK_Cv1

As the final part of this long analysis, I'm covering an alternate version of Batman known as the Grim Knight. Grim Knight is a version of Batman who has no qualms about killing and using guns because he doesn't have the moral code that the traditional Batman holds onto, so he is a darker reflection of what Batman could have been. The reason why I specifically chose the Grim Knight was because I want to illustrate what Batman would be like if he was more like the Punisher. I want people that detest Batman's moral code, to see what Batman would actually like without his moral code and the kind of methods he uses to fight crime. Here is the Grim Knight's origin story:

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 7CewjmVzH0DU1ngrsM61GSFqqLkmGxfeLFfvTLqFj_FUppyt54oMa5xjyUXF51thyi8Qvu2qu_EWtwTEIJWqVFtlnT4vAyTMiq9u_tGXZzeBrMncYasw-G9IV7rI8bsrZihG6XPoCaw=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne UdWg_pJNJaAwMxthaDc-3pZwbgJKlgD9bwtREyhIByJ4r0EGD-F18scz3WegWjFmoO5hMaZ31qyQRfFIzEyqN2jJEujbJZqGpSWWo4JCmoi516kvwFura6DGlf8hSHRDcg1EwREju4E=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 2Vs3JfzfibNh6C46a1-0mz88amN-SAlrJtUlkhBuJUqYles6RO6LJUa9pWeNIPTnxAm-ZyXGisav_hc5V4LmhbhLBUbRGaBRum0W0jjm0MHln-4kDfau_vIPZCjweEDIony9By9TgGM=s0

Yep, in the origin story of this alternate version of Bruce Wayne, Joe Chill drops the gun to search for Martha's pearls, giving a grief stricken Bruce the opportunity to avenge his parents. Bruce picks up the gun and shoots Chill, killing him. Then this happens:

Narrator: It happens with training. With discipline. He traveled the world, learning what he could from every assassin and soldier of fortune he could find. But he knew it wasn't enough. He needed to find a way to kill evil. A weapon that would make him Gotham's own Angel of Death. He needed more than the guns, the knives, the bullets... Something larger than all of that. Something far more deadly. Then suddenly--

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne HfmVNAT2WXPzZgP7xlX_-VhhQLPAaSFuSyhiwStH5tVdDsWlzTkm_2A5lZRNwixSkBYXn7Znt3NHs6ySUCsnzgGHHFnEVLWL_9Kx1Z8vstOkt0Z5ZeR3k5FlX0qbtLVg1FyKCxCzZzE=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne RDCqw7U3VD1g0cH_YnWJZywWzKWCPQckDteXpzXq85GLLXrOnpNfNStxfSDpcND3te_7lIPHBMuvwMRLxaxOVNbxI7_OT5XDmxJRWtwKIDSE5jgM408k-wWBvS3-cA5U7AuJHu2423M=s0

After killing Chill, Bruce spends the next several years pursuing a global quest to seek the means to fight the injustice that took his parents' lives, "learning what he could from every assassin and soldier of fortune he could find" that included training in the use of firearms, knives and explosives. But it wasn't enough. Bruce "needed to find a way to kill evil." Bruce needed a "weapon that would make him Gotham's own Angel of Death." The guns and knives weren't enough, he needed something "far more deadly" than all of that. Whilst Bruce ruminates on all that, a bat flies through a window in Wayne Manor, very much like in Batman: Year One, but this Bruce shoots the bat, and then decides to use the image of a bat as that weapon. His career as Batman, the Grim Knight, begins:

Batman: Ladies. Gentlemen. You have eaten well. You have eaten Gotham's wealth. Its spirit. Your feast is over. From this moment on... No one is safe.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne PrNpNw3B6PNOWQdiDkEZubtNFl1A3SowGp2H1cCGddMTr7lqnnOHfLVO9JI4-i8z4dFHiRmTtP7hgqRC-98WJX8lX8-gns-WbsWz9xU969o5bM0c6_Tal2Efu0p2vpcPFZY43rIWJFo=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne FC5yjMPha1S4Kw_-5YagTLJkq5ScvkRtV1tjaELj7IgNYMTcX9KO7dpMGPH_1yxQhlqPk1h4P7198oUqwvCIpEGTCdtb-BUiXgG6WDVoZPw7WIefpMBkQR5y2oxlAKdWk25n_9nwhnA=s0

Batman attacks a party attended by Gotham's corrupt rich officials that were protecting Gotham's criminal underworld to send them a warning, very much like in Batman: Year One. This Batman however, takes it a step further by burning them alive, which has some interesting consequences on Gotham's criminal underworld:

Narrator: It was the beginning of Batman's war. The men and women in that room had funded and protected the criminal element in his city. Without them, the city erupted itself into a kind of chaos from which he could instill order. He took down Falcone. He took down Zucco. All of the crime bosses of Gotham fell, one by one, without any of the institutional support. In his time, he never faced the kind of colorful enemies the Batman of other worlds did. There was never a murderous clown, though he remembered killing a man in a Red Hood at Ace Chemical. As the Grim Knight rose, he faced an enemy more focused, more determined, than any of the other Batman from any other world.

[...]

Jim: We've had another four major casualties in the last week, all major figures in the criminal underworld... The GCPD needs to start taking the threat Batman represents to this city seriously.

Flass: Oh come off it Gordon. If anything, this bat character is making out jobs easier. We get wrapped in red tape any time we got close to meting out the kind of justice this Batman brings. C'mon, Jim. What wouldn't you give to be able to walk straight up to the bad guys and shoot them in the head without a second thought?

Jim: I'm not denying there's evil in the world, Flass. But why does this man get to draw the line? Why does he get to play the executioner? This isn't justice. This is terror. And the city is going to understand that, soon enough. I have a plan...

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne P4IfW8nzYD73VHPJNjjAb_iRiLEi07-KizwKkc97KHkYqT8s8Ac2yqbc5BSDilaKBRxEfhmhOlsb8p1Gv6y0sGUCHPt9Jn4u8SebQZplBKHaDpONYM7N3WhS-9__IzxpJR-byxDBmF0=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne GjOTP4KIY9Us2mWgsk5RKeHR9T4FvyIbc3Ur7sml2Nhmzk5BTZbowP1fX82LdU6SQXcuSrTg6pBfB7Mydj3EzXgrYDFKGLeAd1O5wjbl3XQvooCk4Cftg0JWFl4LEPVF6UzW68IQX50=s0


By killing the people who funded Gotham's criminal underworld, the city itself "erupted into a kind of chaos from which" Bruce Wayne "could instill order" as Batman. Batman subsequently killed all of Gotham's mob bosses and major criminal figures, including Carmine Falcone, Tony Zucco, Oswald Cobblepot, Roman Sionis and Waylon Jones. This Batman even killed the Red Hood at Ace Chemical Processing Plant, and we all know what that implies. Most of the GCPD don't care because it makes their jobs easier, but Jim Gordon condemns the Batman's crusade due to his lethal methods, so he comes up with a plan:

Jim: Any minute now...

Cop: You sure this is going to work, lieutenant?

Jim: It better. [...] TAKE COVER. HE'S HERE!

Batman: I thought you were smarter than this. Why draw me out with a light?


Jim: It's not just a light. It's a magnet. Now! [...] It took ages, but we found the arsenals you've planted around the city. All your little ammunition dumps for this war of terror. My men just got the order to raid each of them. They're taking them now. I have a detailed record of every murder, Batman. Every single one. The rest of the force may have gotten sloppy, may have even encouraged this war of yours, but I've been filing the paperwork. We're going to unmask you here. Take you into custody. Put you in front of a judge and finally hold you accountable for all the horror you've unleashed.

Batman: How much did Gordon have to pay you all to stand here with him? You know whose city this is. And you can take off the masks. You're idiots if you don't think I know each of your names.

Jim: You're bluffing. I just spent the entire city's slush fund on Wayne Enterprises tech to mask their identities.

Batman: Money well spent.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne GD8e7oFRvFgqheT7T_x0NOHJyfJkm3v2JcbCA5uu6XDwzk0c2Kji9hv65UxSXnIkok6pIGpjdyuvjYdOfLbrcS6rOK-nfbgcCb-YnuzUkrRJE4_7UVXOUgjOrZT98vrkPOgNdjiVgwM=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne He1cJQjHmYEMQUpGHrmgi-XtP0LxuhWmJf_fjTSrxhx_xnx2kIBfkrFY5XXDDuC-8hTQQcrMlGAxD9-Oek5hbiqooSCe0yoJj86Q-xgEUOcuriqtUTB-tb23xXCjBCk5o1Q-2KxccW4=s0

The GCPD managed to find and raid Batman's concealed arsenals and built a Bat-Signal with a concealed magnet within to lure Batman to a trap. Their plan seems to be working, or so they thought:

Jim: Why the hell are you smiling?

Cop: Jim... My chest... It feels hot...

Jim: What?

*Several cops die*

Jim: NO!

Batman: Vocal disarm. Code 144520.

Jim: You... Have the right to remain silent...

Batman: Yeah... Tell me Jim... Tell me my rights, and I'll tell you yours. You have the right to bribe an army of corrupt officers to follow you on a fool's errand. You have the right to send them walking to their deaths in each of those arsenals you thought you were raiding.


Jim: Oh god...


Batman: You've given me a good fight Jim. But you're in my way. In the way of what this city can be. Some day, you'll thank me for this.

GCPD Radio: Lieutenant Gordon! Come in! We've lost control of the blimps' navigational systems... The full fleet is dive-bombing two targets in the city... Blackgate and Arkham Asylum. Oh god, the hydrogen cells, they're going to kill every criminal in Gotham, sane or insane! We can't reach them to tell them to evacuate. This is the only open line. Help us! PLEASE!

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne LS52shyQnGxqaCOn4PhE3POBZcV9MwVONcv1h5whX5a3q-QEz1cuyJoYGA5BBf0ESLkeC94K89CglWcBG1m8JKyxG2Y8A97CQQ7VLDKWx6IEKhXLSNU2cAbrET8MlhvdNUemoIH_fgI=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 84HRUblkzbKMGysnu-ymmxDDjpcqzPAkMeSvp-n6RYcPF91D06l4FILu9BwZA7VJwt1Ix43JjyBnkEnkTC4hGyDTZm88V6GsIqPs4el0bU6d6MsXfXFM9e2JGU-j4KpDUsBFiFmiKcs=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne CzuBjELTaNRxZQbcDS0Ahply-BsKfcnIAXTRWNCZPBQD0MFfC_BC0xpXsmSwKwqIHdlMe7ZoTvIz8ZhEtU-y2_PwZ5cm_LeGFDvD_GGsT45CJRcjDcgpKHLY2JFY8O-746OLP1pr77M=s0

The GCPD had unfortunately used Wayne Enterprises technology for their plan, which Batman used to disable the Bat-Signal's magnet, kill Gordon's men on the roof, viewing Gordon's men as corrupt. Batman and Jim fight, Batman defeats Gordon, ties him up and makes him watch two highly explosive blimps crash into Arkham Asylum and Blackgate Prison, killing all criminals in the city. Batman's lethal crusade continues:

Narrator: The Grim Knight remembered then, the good days. What Gotham had become. How it felt to wield it. How it felt to make sure what had happened to him would never happen to another.

*Mugger dies*

Nameless mother:
Oh, oh god.

Mugger:
GGUCK...

*Child cries*

Nameless father:
Stop, Roger! Stop crying... This... This was good, y'know. We... We have to smile, right? The Batman is always watching. We need to say thank you.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 9UPhosKycORylZ7Biao38RPgquGkWTD2coLpkhjxAMSTXWy8dFmR1B0V-vilszCJk3DiKTn3A0KLRtWxD-RoBSXM0YpT-_2FudqOMuxBd7KUguBDib7tJ2PP64zYrxeOSPmhXI2W-nY=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne HHjbINkgA2riehw0mqM2Vx9u7ElW-uxZDYVUZrTlLmH6DHGko01hoykFzQa1GO0w8axSozTaqWh5q91Dq92__ZklIAsyu_V9IJCxkqfVMkW_MwErdzvSAzLn_j3TZNR6M-f1KpWJQM8=s0

A married couple with a child are attacked by a mugger, similarly to how Bruce and his parents were attacked by Joe Chill, but in this situation, Bruce uses an automated gun to kill the mugger "to make sure what had happened to him would never happen to another" whilst he's operating from the batcave. Batman's lethal crusade continues:

Alfred: Sir...

Family: T-thank you Batman!

Bruce: Quiet Alfred. Watch a minute with me.

Alfred: Sir... Wait...

Bruce: A child predator. A corrupt judge. Both dead... The city is my scythe, Alfred.

Alfred: This... This isn't what I agreed to. This isn't... What your parents would want.

Bruce: If you leave...

Alfred: You'll activate the implant in my neck and kill me. I know. But I'm leaving all the same. I love you always... But I'm done.

Bruce: Computer, give me the whereabouts of Jim Gordon.

Computer: No sightings. Six weeks.

Bruce: Hmm.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne TdHWBqUMuPLyPKVjoMyFyaESGVUjuW9yu27mngnNXHv-VX8NcZ_WGYmq-odAqRLvJazSnG1Ag8jbxxVq-6Q5CxbAhFARH9CHnvu6hInFBOkTmz2RGAsDrdkIQiHzvimrAeUl1-AL9_s=s0
Psychology of Bruce Wayne UgOGrOmil3wsyT7oTwysKQEHnrJ7kr_CtM_f0WqqjtmAJ-ddT9jG_FEutVlactO6REqRRQHERfb-sy5nHhff_645TTUIp0BPcNjppjd4ZySsnJn2Djcqt2asa_tD9rHsDM3M90MTm7E=s0

Batman kills a child predator by causing his car to drive off a bridge, and kills a corrupt judge by causing his medical implants to fail him. As brutal and ruthless as that is, Gotham actually becomes a much safer place under Batman's lethal surveillance. Alfred Pennyworth however, leaves Bruce out of disgust with his methods. Bruce threatens to kill Alfred by activating an explosive implant installed in Alfred's neck for leaving him, but changes his mind and turns his attention to Jim Gordon, who hasn't been seen for 6 weeks. This is what Jim was doing during all that time:

Jim: I've got you, you piece of shit.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne YYZzYfulDQwGH6uzGuAlnmb8PdvecjPceWm5DpxFVH1FjxB-kPW4f3v9rWh7cKobIhwLDvHV76ps1cIbFdos9an7IvE9tW7wgK4zJsnuwgtZKGdB3YHZlP772dpcRy75Eou3mlIjLSc=s0

Jim deduces that Batman is Bruce Wayne after 6 weeks of honest detective work, using little to no technology. Then this happens:

Thorne: The message I got said it was urgent. I rushed here from the district court...

Harvey: Thorne, I have no idea what you're talking about... I didn't call for you...

Jim: I did. And I just killed all the electronics in the building. You can thank me for it later. He has eyes everywhere.

Harvey: Gordon?! I thought you were dead.

Jim: Not yet. I needed you to sign off on the raid, Dent. I already have the backing of the FBI in Washington.

Harvey: If you know who Batman is, why not just sneak into his house and end it? Before he gets wind of what you're doing--

Jim: He has to go by the book to prove the book can work. You were a believer, Harvey. Before he irradiated your face and you caved to his methods. You helped give him this city. Turn it into a weapon. Now's your chance. Now you can break it.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1

Then this happens:

Jim: BRUCE WAYNE! Come out with your hands up!

Bruce: Lieutenant Gordon, I think you have me confused for someone else. Do you realize how much I've donated to the GCPD in the last year alone?

Jim: Yes. That's how you pulled it off. How you put your bugs in everything to control "your" city. But it's not yours anymore. Our men raided Wayne Enterprises thirty minutes ago. Your bat-sentries are being dismantled as we speak.

Bruce: There really must be some kind of mistake...

Jim: No, Bruce. Your butler gave us the kill codes. He's gone on the record about everything. There's no coming back from this.

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 2

Then this happens:

Narrator: He remembers the fury. The utter humiliation of being disarmed in front of so many. The Grim Knight remembers thinking how many people would die that night because the order he had brought to his city was gone. His life's work, his great weapon, dismantled in front of him.

Jim: YOU ARE UNDER ARREST!

Source — The Batman Who Laughs: The Grim Knight.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne L8IaF7nWB7xMVplzZ4K-lN0FSfAdMn161i3Dnm5OmUArZJVH9Dq14CG8SWw-tw50GYNc_rufC1SAY8oB9oxLvsufxhj9HYye1XD01rOe6f2uaLwYi5QokyX57OuQIXfd9mZqCTxYCl0=s0

That sums up the Grim Knight's origin and backstory. When I talked about Batman's moral code earlier, I said that I wasn't going to comment on the ethics of his moral code, and I am going to do the same for the Grim Knight, largely because discussions and debates about moral issues in superhero stories are tedious ad nauseam. Discussions and debates about morality in general are tedious ad nauseam, so I am not going to compare and contrast Batman and Grim Knight's methods as for whose methods are morally just and whose aren't morally just.

That being said, Grim Knight definitely took very extreme measures to eradicate crime and corruption from Gotham. He killed Gotham's corrupt rich officials by burning them alive because they were funding and protecting Gotham's criminal underworld. Grim Knight didn't even have a rogues gallery like the traditional Batman did because he killed them all before they could become his enemies. He killed all the mob bosses, which were included, but not limited to Carmine Falcone, Tony Zucco, Oswald Cobblepot (AKA Penguin), Roman Sionis (AKA Black Mask) and Waylon Jones (AKA Killer Croc). The Grim Knight even killed the Red Hood at Ace Chemical Processing Plant, meaning that there was no Joker in their world because he was killed before he could fall into the lake of chemicals. He even went as far as causing two blimps to crash into Blackgate Prison and Arkham Asylum, knowing fully that they were going to kill every criminal in Gotham, regardless of whether they were deemed sane or insane.

But the killing didn't stop there. This Batman killed corrupt cops from the GCPD when they tried to lure him to a trap, he brutally killed a corrupt judge by causing his medical implants to fail him, so he had no qualms about killing corrupt law enforcement that didn't do their jobs justly. Alfred was so disgusted with Batman's methods that he left him, believing that this wasn't what Batman's parents would've wanted. This Batman even threatened to kill Alfred by activating the explosive implant he installed in Alfred's neck, simply for just leaving him, though he did admittedly change his mind. But what's even more extreme is that he irradiated half of Mayor Harvey Dent's face to coerce him into caving into his methods of fighting crime. Let that sink in.

Granted, Grim Knight does exhibit some level of honour. He saved a family from being murdered by a mugger by shooting the mugger to "make sure what had happened to him would never happen to another" very much like the traditional Batman wanted, the only difference being that Grim Knight was willing to kill. And despite how brutal and ruthless he was, Gotham actually became a safe place under his surveillance because all the mob bosses and major criminal figures were killed, and he was monitoring much of the city. Grim Knight may not have had to deal with a homicidal madman like the Joker, but he became an enemy of the law. Jim Gordon condemned him, asking Flass "why does this man get to draw the line? Why does he get to play the executioner?" and saying "This isn't justice. This is terror." It wasn't just Jim Gordon who condemned him, the FBI in Washington also condemned him, signing an arrest warrant for Bruce Wayne. Alfred also condemned by giving the GCPD the "kill codes" and had also "gone on the record about everything." In the end, this version of Batman got subdued by the law. It took 6 weeks for Jim Gordon to deduce that Bruce Wayne is Batman despite having little to no access to technology (he did this to avoid being tracked by Batman), and he had only met Batman face to face once. And when the law was finally ready to arrest Bruce, Jim and the FBI showed up outside Wayne Manor and easily apprehended him. Bruce tried to resist, but was outfought by Jim. And ironically enough, his reliance on firearms was what led to his defeat because he was not only swiftly disarmed, he got humiliated in unarmed combat. This is because he didn't have the martial arts knowledge and skill that the traditional Batman did. When this Batman went on a global quest to seek the means to fight the injustice that took his parents' lives away, it was stated that he sought training "from every assassin and soldier of fortune he could find" which wasn't what the traditional Batman did, he sought training from the greatest minds in martial arts, among other things.

And it's honestly no surprise that the Grim Knight became an enemy of the law. In Batman: Hush, Batman nearly beats the Joker to death, but Jim stops him and gives Batman a warning:

Jim: You and I have seen more than our fair share of tragedies and thirsted for revenge. If Batman wanted to be a killer, he could have started long ago. But, it's a line, on one side we believe in the law. On the other... Sometimes, the law fails us. Maybe that's why I understood you... Allowed you to help protect the city. Batman, if you cross that line -- if you kill the Joker tonight -- I will lead the hunt to bring you to justice. In the eyes of the law... In my eyes, you'll be no different than him.

Batman: How many more lives are we going to allow him to ruin?

Jim: I don't care, I won't let him ruin yours.

Source — Batman: Hush Issue #7.

Spoiler:

Psychology of Bruce Wayne SgkG6BKP6tCy8XIvFzqU3qWOeYvfStYQ7Ge-fVGxCGJJY0uPqR4y7fDORUUHMOK4pzEPnXwu8OWK=s0

Jim warns Batman that if he becomes an executioner, he'll terminate their friendship and lead a law enforcement hunt to bring Batman to justice. Batman just isn't allowed to be an executioner because the GCPD has imposed restrictions on what he's allowed to do. Jim is more than capable of apprehending Batman because he already subconsciously knows who Batman is, so it wouldn't take him long to confirm his suspicion that Bruce Wayne is Batman and bring Batman behind bars. We've seen what happened to the Grim Knight, he eventually got captured by law enforcement agencies. The same would likely happen to Post Crisis Batman if he started killing people.

Closing Statements


Psychology of Bruce Wayne 413ead2ab0f00fb6caac056135c90a1b

This marks the end of my analysis. Yeah, I know I may have went overkill with it, there's a lot to read, but it was worth writing to be honest, not only because Batman is such a psychologically fascinating and complex character, but he's also very inspiring. He inspires me, he inspires a lot of other people, and I hope he inspires you. I hope you learn something useful if you manage to read through all of this. Thanks for reading if you did.


Last edited by Latham2000 on January 25th 2021, 8:43 am; edited 8 times in total
The Adventurous Jedi
The Adventurous Jedi
Level Seven
Level Seven

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 21st 2020, 1:17 pm
Psychology of Bruce Wayne 2864379292

I'll take a look at this later, but I may not end up finishing it due to the length. Props to the effort, though - and from the little snippets I read while scrolling down to comment, it looks good.
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 21st 2020, 1:21 pm
NotAA3 wrote:Psychology of Bruce Wayne 2864379292

I'll take a look at this later, but I may not end up finishing it due to the length. Props to the effort, though - and from the little snippets I read while scrolling down to comment, it looks good.

Yeah, I did go pretty overkill with this. If if the length ends up being too much for you to finish reading it, don't bother reading the comic scans that are too hard to read and/or if you've already read them, just stick with reading the text, if that helps. Thanks anyway Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1289255181
The lord of hunger
The lord of hunger
Level Two
Level Two

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 22nd 2020, 10:58 am
this is possibly one of the few threads when i see the creator of those actually understanding the character good read ngl

PD: im sure if you post it on the vine people whould really like it
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 22nd 2020, 12:35 pm
@The lord of hunger wrote:this is possibly one of the few threads when i see the creator of those actually understanding the character good read ngl

PD: im sure if you post it on the vine people whould really like it

Thanks.

I thought about posting this on comic vine, but decided not to do it because comic vine's formatting wouldn't make it easy to read through. CV doesn't allow you to change the colour of your text like this site does, which is what I wanted to do and have demonstrably done in all 4 parts of my analysis, so that people can read through it more easily.
HellfireUnit
HellfireUnit
Level Six
Level Six

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 22nd 2020, 12:39 pm
Disgusting post. HiTop Films do much better.
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 22nd 2020, 12:43 pm
@HellfireUnit wrote:Disgusting post. HiTop Films do much better.

Psychology of Bruce Wayne 4183286560
Nute_Chethray
Nute_Chethray
Moderator
Moderator

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 22nd 2020, 12:57 pm
I've read lots of it (though not close to half). Great work mate Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1289255181

I actually never knew the "Red Hood" backstory for Joker in the Killing Joke
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 22nd 2020, 1:43 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
@Nute_Chethray wrote:I've read lots of it (though not close to half). Great work mate Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1289255181

I actually never knew the "Red Hood" backstory for Joker in the Killing Joke

That's OK, read at your own pace, but thanks Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1289255181 

The Killing Joke has a great potential backstory for Joker, and the story has great moral undertones about human beings and their bad days, so I highly recommend it.
Kermit
Kermit

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 27th 2020, 10:53 am
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
As a fellow Batman fan you have no idea how much this means to me, keep it up you're doing God's work. Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1289255181

About almost a quarter of the way done with the entire thing lmao.
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 27th 2020, 1:23 pm
@Kermit wrote:As a fellow Batman fan you have no idea how much this means to me, keep it up you're doing God's work.  Psychology of Bruce Wayne 1289255181

Thank you so much. I'm glad to hear this means something to you.

@Kermit wrote:About almost a quarter of the way done with the entire thing lmao.

Take your time with it, I know how lengthy this is. Hope you manage to read through it all.
xolthol
xolthol
Champion of the Light
Champion of the Light

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 27th 2020, 4:02 pm
Insanely great work well done!
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 27th 2020, 4:30 pm
@xolthol wrote:Insanely great work well done!

Thanks! Did you actually manage to read it all?
xolthol
xolthol
Champion of the Light
Champion of the Light

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 28th 2020, 2:48 pm
Well I haven't finished yet but I've been far enough to appreciate the quality of the work
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 28th 2020, 3:31 pm
@xolthol wrote:Well I haven't finished yet but I've been far enough to appreciate the quality of the work

I see, but thanks anyway. What post have you read up to?
Necromancer76
Necromancer76

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 28th 2020, 10:03 pm
What an excellent blog. Well done my friend. I was particularly intrigued by post 2 and all of the examples you provided to prove that Batman is not an anti-hero (or a sociopath).
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 29th 2020, 7:41 am
@Necromancer76 wrote:What an excellent blog. Well done my friend. I was particularly intrigued by post 2 and all of the examples you provided to prove that Batman is not an anti-hero (or a sociopath).

Thanks dude. Good to hear that you were particularly intrigued by post 2.
Thrawn
Thrawn

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 29th 2020, 4:41 pm
I just read Batman: 3 Jokers.

It's one of the best comic books I've read in years. It will probably go down as one of my favorite Batman stories.

There's some fundamental revelations concerning Joe Chill, Batman and the Joker's secret identities, and families.

There's some good material there for your article, Latham.
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 29th 2020, 4:54 pm
@Thrawn wrote:I just read Batman: 3 Jokers.

It's one of the best comic books I've read in years. It will probably go down as one of my favorite Batman stories.

There's some fundamental revelations concerning Joe Chill, Batman and the Joker's secret identities, and families.

There's some good material there for your article, Latham.  

I haven’t read it yet because I am not much of a fan of New 52/Rebirth continuity (thanks Dan Didio). But thanks for sharing, I’ll check it out later, though I would rather get some Post Crisis stories out of the way. No Man’s Land is ridiculously long, even for me.

Were you able to read through my thread?
Thrawn
Thrawn

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 29th 2020, 5:24 pm
@Latham2000 wrote:
I haven’t read it yet because I am not much of a fan of New 52/Rebirth continuity (thanks Dan Didio).

I'm not a fan of the new 52 either, but do yourself a favor and read Batman: 3 Jokers. It's three extra long issues, you can read it in 45 minutes. There's no real padding and it gets straight to the point.

Were you able to read through my thread?

I've read one section so far. The "Is Batman Insane" section.

It's quite good. Batman is my favorite super hero.

I agree 100% with Denny O'Neil.

Batman is above all else a Hero. He's a hero among heroes. He's a good man.

The idea that Batman is insane is not supported by logic, and more than that it's a lazy take. It's something I've found people say when they want to be "edgy".

--------

I've also found the idea that Batman's Rogues Gallery somehow each reflect some aspect of Batman's personality to be ridiculous.

I've seen writers, directors, and producers try to make the same stupid argument with Spider-Man's Rogue's gallery. Doc Ock, Green Goblin, Lizard, etc all reflect some aspect of Spider-Man...and they don't beyond the most superficial level.

This need to publicly try and link villains to some aspect of the hero in a confusing need to create some deeper connection is baffling to me.

I think it's a crutch weak writers are using to lean on in lieu of actual talent.

--------

Take Michael Myers vs Laurie Strode.

Did you know that's one of the longest running feuds on film and in fiction?

It's been going on for 40+ years. It's ICONIC.

It's spans 3 different timelines, a remake; 7 movies to date with #8 on the way.

Michael and Laurie have nothing in common and no deep connection even when they're related.

It's one of the most personal and exciting rivalries on film, and there is no artificially created "deep connection".

Same for Batman and most of his rogues. Batman has nothing in common with Bane or Penguin, but they're still personal rivalries.
Latham2000
Latham2000
Level Three
Level Three

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

October 30th 2020, 10:06 am
@Thrawn wrote:
@Latham2000 wrote:
I haven’t read it yet because I am not much of a fan of New 52/Rebirth continuity (thanks Dan Didio).

I'm not a fan of the new 52 either, but do yourself a favor and read Batman: 3 Jokers. It's three extra long issues, you can read it in 45 minutes. There's no real padding and it gets straight to the point.

Sure thing, I'll get around to reading it later.

@Thrawn wrote:I've read one section so far. The "Is Batman Insane" section.

It's quite good. Batman is my favorite super hero.

I agree 100% with Denny O'Neil.

Batman is above all else a Hero. He's a hero among heroes. He's a good man.

The idea that Batman is insane is not supported by logic, and more than that it's a lazy take. It's something I've found people say when they want to be "edgy".

Thanks, and I absolutely agree with your sentiment about the idea of Batman being insane. It's just a lazy fan theory, and people who say it just come across as edgy. In fact, I've seen the same type of people argue that Poison Ivy is an environmental hero, saying Poison Ivy helps the enviroment... Pretty shit takes if you ask me. If Batman was insane, Scarecrow's fear toxic wouldn't have any effect on him, but we know it does because it has demonstrably been proven that Scarecrow's fear toxin exploits Batman's inner demons e.g. Knightfall and The Long Halloween

@Thrawn wrote:I've also found the idea that Batman's Rogues Gallery somehow each reflect some aspect of Batman's personality to be ridiculous.

I've seen writers, directors, and producers try to make the same stupid argument with Spider-Man's Rogue's gallery. Doc Ock, Green Goblin, Lizard, etc all reflect some aspect of Spider-Man...and they don't beyond the most superficial level.

This need to publicly try and link villains to some aspect of the hero in a confusing need to create some deeper connection is baffling to me.

I think it's a crutch weak writers are using to lean on in lieu of actual talent.

--------

Take Michael Myers vs Laurie Strode.

Did you know that's one of the longest running feuds on film and in fiction?

It's been going on for 40+ years. It's ICONIC.

It's spans 3 different timelines, a remake; 7 movies to date with #8 on the way.

Michael and Laurie have nothing in common and no deep connection even when they're related.

It's one of the most personal and exciting rivalries on film, and there is no artificially created "deep connection".

Same for Batman and most of his rogues. Batman has nothing in common with Bane or Penguin, but they're still personal rivalries.

I'm glad you brought this up, because I actually talked about this in the "Batman's Rogues Gallery" section and I think you might like that section too. And I absolutely agree with that Spider-Man's Rogues Gallery don't really have anything in common with Spider-Man beyond the most superficial level. In my "Batman's Rogues Gallery" section, I said this: "Ra's al Ghul, Killer Croc, Clay Face, Black Mask, Poison Ivy, Mad Hatter and various others have very little in common with Batman. Not every one of Batman's villains experienced tragedy, some did, but not all of them did. And even in that case, I think the idea that Batman's villains are darker reflections of himself on the basis that they experienced tragedy but chose a different path can be said about pretty much every superhero and their rogues gallery (and pretty much all heroes and villains in general), which not only takes away what makes these villains great, it's also a reductive because it's not what defines these villains" which sums up my thoughts on the superficial similarities between heroes and villains that constantly get exaggerated by people.

I've heard about that Michael Myers vs Laurie Strode rivlarly, I'm not much of a horror fan. But yes, I do agree that heroes and villains can have great rivalries without some sort of deep personal connection, whether it is organic or artificially created.
Sponsored content

Psychology of Bruce Wayne Empty Re: Psychology of Bruce Wayne

Back to top
Permissions in this forum:
You can reply to topics in this forum