Wyyrlok vs Arcann

Morals on



Prime versions

More impressed by Wyyrlok briefly holding his own against Krayt than Arcann getting one-shot by someone sub-Krayt

Arcann takes this.

i think it depends. arcann is clearly tougher and more experienced, but idk if he is stronger or more skilled in a fight. wyyrlock surely has the better and more powers. he is overall better with the force, but i doubt that he is more powerful than arcann. him fighting krayt doenst mean he is ~ to krayt. it means he did well against krayt. actually, he is factually below vong krayt, even at his best in chapter 1. and vong krayt =/= prime krayt, who is much, much stronger. wyyrlok wont get one shotted, imo, but he is weaker as far as i can tell. it will wits and overall force advantage vs durability, experience, power, and martial skill. whoever uses it better wins.

Azronger wrote:More impressed by Wyyrlok briefly holding his own against Krayt than Arcann getting one-shot by someone sub-Krayt

How is Valk sub Krayt?

Arcann held off lightning capable of killing hundreds of people with its unfocused energies alone, which is honestly more powerful than anything I've seen Krayt bring to the table in offensive Force attacks. Arcann then went through immense psychological and physical growth on top of this.

Arcann has this.

EmperorCaedus wrote:

Azronger wrote:More impressed by Wyyrlok briefly holding his own against Krayt than Arcann getting one-shot by someone sub-Krayt

How is Valk sub Krayt?

Valkorion is less powerful than pre-suit Vader per at least four statements. Krayt, on the other hand, scales above the RotS titans.

Wyyrlok.

Wyyrlok wins.

@Shioz
@Meatpants


Reason?

The performance against Darth Krayt is more impressive than anything Arcann has, tbh. Even if we assume that Wyyrlok is no more powerful than Arcann, his fighting style, based on influencing the mind of the enemy, can give him victory.

@Azronger 

Valkorion is less powerful than pre-suit Vader per at least four statements. Krayt, on the other hand, scales above the RotS titans.

Uh, wut? I assume you're referring to KOTFE spirit Valkorion, and not prime Valk.

I'm referring to any "enemy ever faced by the Jedi" up to Anakin's fall, which includes Valkorion.

That's off the back of a toy, and the Jedi never actually faced Valkorion. Valk was dead as far as the rest of the galaxy knew.

The Outlander is no longer a Jedi in KOTFE?

Meatpants wrote:The Outlander is no longer a Jedi in KOTFE?

??? 

"Jedi" is obviously meant in the plural sense, as in the Order itself. The Jedi (plural) had no idea he was still alive and everyone except Lana, the Outlander, Satele and Marr thought he was gone forever. Also, Valkorion was no longer the main threat or even a real threat as far as the Outlander was concerned, hence their alliance. Arcann and Vaylin were the threats.

No matter which way you look at it, Valkorion was not considered a threat by the Jedi in KOTFE/KOTET, both because almost none of them knew he was still alive and also because he wasn't actively opposing them and was in fact helping them to deal with a more pressing threat.

It's also worth noting that the idea of a "threat" is vague as hell. I'd say one of two Sith who orchestrated a decade long plan that left the Jedi in quite possibly the worst position they've ever been in (all but extinct) was more of a threat than someone not actively opposing them. That doesn't automatically transfer over into power.

Ah, I forgot there wasn't a cutscene where Valkorion explicitly says he's attempting to threaten the Jedi Order. 

You don't have to be working actively/overtly to be a threat. Tenebrae, an ancient Sith entity capable of a galaxy-killing ritual (and almost succeeded at pulling it off) who's now in control of a fleet capable of utterly pacifying the Empire and Republic (and thus, by extension, the Jedi) simultaneously is a threat.

Even if we want to go your route, which is that "Arcann and Vaylin were the threats." the position stands regardless. If Arcann, who literally set the Eternal Fleet on the Republic (which includes the Jedi Order) and pacified them into a permanent tributary state is inferior as a threat to Vader, how exactly has anything changed?

If anything, you should be attacking Krayt's scaling, since Azronger has posited he scales above the ROTS titans, who include Vader. So we get Krayt > Vader > Arcann.

Your entire rebuttal is built on false premises:

1. You can't be seen as a threat by the Order if the Order doesn't even know you're still alive. 

2. They didn't know he had that fleet, so that point is moot. When they found out Valk was in control of it, he was killed shortly after and only two people (Outlander and Marr) even knew it was Valkorion until he was struck down and Satele and the others felt the ripples through the Force to identify it. So again, moot point.

3. Again, threat =/= power. Of course two Sith who've left your Order in the worst situation it's ever been is going to be more of a threat

Also, that source is from a Hasbro toy. Hasbro are not an official Star Wars authority, only a company given licensing rights to produce toys on their behalf and use whatever advertising they want. That "most powerful enemy ever faced by the Jedi" is just another case of that.