enraged RoTJ luke vs SoD darth maul

1. sabers
2. force
3. all out

battle takes place on board of IH .

i think luke wins all of them. he is stronger than starkiller after all, isnt he? should be just as skilled, albeit not as smart or experienced

Luke. He dominated RotJ Vader which I don't see a peer of Kenobi replicating.

he didnt dominate anybody lol

lorenzo.r.2nd

The movie disagrees

the movie also has obi wan saying he grew, right after he said he got weaker. didnt the movie also have vader walking through sheev's lightning, which was killing luke in no time when not at full power. plus, the movie also has vader as a semi lightsider when he fights luke, all the while holding back a to not kill him.

Luke dominating sub TPM Kenobi Vader isn't impressive when we stack it up against Maul's feats.

OT-Maul.

i still wonder where this sub TPM obi wan tihng came from lol u wanna tell me that every single one of the hundres of jedis that he killed were weaker than TPM kenobi? the dark woman, roan shryne, all those 5 jedi masters who were also prepared for him, star killer, and then luke, who is literally said to have been his strongest opponent yet, which means he is factually above mustafar kenobi. also stronger than his mustafar self, who is factually above kenobi's prime lmao

@lorenzo.r.2nd:

i still wonder where this sub TPM obi wan tihng came from lol

The word of God, Lucas himself.

u wanna tell me that every single one of the hundres of jedis that he killed were weaker than TPM kenobi?

the dark woman, roan shryne, all those 5 jedi masters who were also prepared for him,

Unless you can provide evidence to the contrary, yes.

star killer,

Who beat him while on the verge of death after atomising the salvation and fighting through an army of clones collectively above Vader? Next.

and then luke, who is literally said to have been his strongest opponent yet, which means he is factually above mustafar kenobi. also stronger than his mustafar self, who is factually above kenobi's prime lmao

Citation needed.

oh man this is gonna fun. i can tell. 

word of god also says that vader is 80% of sidious, making TPM closer to sidous than vader is. sidous in rotj is stronger than in rots, and he is stronger than obi wan at his prime there too. so yeah, ur scaling is now like this: vader< TPM kenobi< prime kenobi< dark side anakin< vader < TPM kenobi < prime kenobi, etc etc etc... i dont think i need to keep going.

lol ok man, ok, ill take u on. So, TPM kenobi is weaker than jinn, who is more or less equal to Roan shryne, who is a council member level jedi, and he lost to 19 BBY vader after mustafar, who is<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< prime vader. thats a simple one, isnt it? galen marek in a much weaker form beat an amped council member level jedi, so that alone makes him stronger than both jinn and TPM kenobi. he then got much stronger as star killer. oh, and tired and all that is nice and good, but not as effective when vader was holding back the whole time, and when vader still had a weakness to his lightning the whole time. then we also have the force, which can wash away fatigue, and in the dark side's case, make u even stronger than before by a good bit. so yeah no. on the next thing.

Many years later, Obi-Wan and Darth Vader duel a second time. The Sith Lord is now more experienced and powerful. --Beware The Sith...


This duel was very different from their last. Obi-Wan was older and weaker while Vader was even stronger, fueled by hatred and thirst for revenge. --Jedi Battles... 



[i]“This is a fight you cannot win, Darth. Your power has matured since I taught you, but I too have grown much since our parting. If my blade finds its mark, you will cease to exist. But if you cut me down, I will only become more powerful. Heed my words.” --A New Hope... 
[/i]


[i]Obi-Wan, enraged by betryal, battled Vader in an epic clash of lightsbers. Kenobi emerged victorious, sure that his one-time companion and pupil was destroyed. But the Force was strong in Vader, stronger than Kenobi knew, and somehow, Vader survived the terrible wounds he received. Vader survived, but not unscarred-his shattered body encased in life-supporting armor and a breath mask. In spite of these handicaps, Vader thrived. in fact, he found a way to turn these to his advantage. He had his breath mask crafted into a sinister black helmet and, donning a black cloak over his black armor, he became a figure out of nightmare. From the ashes of defeat, Vader emerged even stronger. --Lightsaber Dueling Pack: Darth Vader... 
[/i]


[i]More powerful in the Force than ever before as well as a master of the lightsaber, Darth Vader prepares for his final battle as the Rebel fleet hammers the fully operational Death Star. --Darth Vader Return Of Anakin Skywalker...
[/i]

this is all for vader being above anakin ^^^

this stuff down here is for luke being his strongest jedi opponent yet. i got that wrong. not all of his opponents, meaning that ROTJ luke is at max equal to star killer. u helped me prove my own point, thanks


Obi-Wan was gone, and the other Jedi were all extinct, save one, who was the strongest of them all. His own son. He had told the Emperor that Luke Skywalker would join them or die. The real truth was only slightly different: Luke would join Darth Vader or die. It would be something to look forward to. That would be the duel of a lifetime. This wasn’t even exercise.

Looks like you're gonna have the time of your life debunking these arguments DC77

sadly lucas is no longer the god of star wars .
trying to make a case for RoTJ vader being < TPM kenobi is either low quality bait or down right delusional fanboy stuff .
going by this logic TPM kenobi could content with (at least) TPM sidious or plagueis .
i think i don´t need to point out how ridiculous this sounds .

TPM kenobi is not impressive at all . his only feat is to cheap shot an overly confident (read cocky) TPM darth maul .
he wasn´t even that much of a factor in that fight until jinn died .

@lorenzo.r.2nd:

oh man this is gonna fun. i can tell.

Probably more so for me darling.

word of god also says that vader is 80% of sidious,

Couple of things to note here:

1) Lucas himself is inherently unsure about the statement, saying that it's maybe the case, rather than treating it as irrefutable.

2) The 80% is impossible to quantify, we have no reference point for what it actually means. What is 10%? What is 60%? Starting to see my point here? 

lol ok man, ok, ill take u on.

I was under the impression we were having a friendly chat darling, not a battle of wills.

So, TPM kenobi is weaker than jinn, who is more or less equal to Roan shryne, who is a council member level jedi, and he lost to 19 BBY vader after mustafar, who is<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< prime vader. thats a simple one, isnt it?

On what basis is Roan=>Jinn?

galen marek in a much weaker form beat an amped council member level jedi, so that alone makes him stronger than both jinn and TPM kenobi.

Why?

oh, and tired and all that is nice and good, but not as effective when vader was holding back the whole time,

Dismissing everything I just noted as "well he was tired" is utterly ridiculous. He'd literally burnt himself out atomising the Salvation, then done a repeat performance of that by fighting his way through an army that outclassed Vader (Something you failed to address) all before going up against the man himself. The text explicitly emphasises that he was more exhausted than when his very survival was at stake. Also, proof Vader was holding back?

and when vader still had a weakness to his lightning the whole time.

A weakness he has in any fight you mean? Moreover, SK demonstrated superiority by getting him into a position where disabling him with lightning was possible. Either way, SK's still better.

then we also have the force, which can wash away fatigue, and in the dark side's case, make u even stronger than before by a good bit.

There's an important distinction between regaining force reserves (What SK had to do, and washing away fatigue). The former is impossible without food and extensive meditation, ergo, SK was still exhausted. And while your point about the dark side is true, it's irrelevant as SK never drew upon the dark side for a rage amp during their fight.

this is all for vader being above anakin ^^^

Overruled by Lucas, per the methodology we abide by.

this stuff down here is for luke being his strongest jedi opponent yet. i got that wrong. not all of his opponents, meaning that ROTJ luke is at max equal to star killer. u helped me prove my own point, thanks

Why would we presume Vader's musings are accurate?

Also, I was banned for a month but last I was here you weren't. Welcome to the forum man, hope you enjoy your stay.

KingofBlades wrote:Looks like you're gonna have the time of your life debunking these arguments DC77

Hardly.

Why are you calling him darling lol

imma go eat. ill answer after i come back. see ya in a bit

@KingofBlades It was actually quite enjoyable darling, the new guy seems cool.

This dude on the other hand:

@dark_globe

Less so. Long time no see darling.

sadly lucas is no longer the god of star wars .

Thread is EU, unless specified otherwise. So far you have failed to do so, meaning that Lucas's word still counts.

trying to make a case for RoTJ vader being < TPM kenobi is either low quality bait or down right delusional fanboy stuff .

I'm not interested in your textbook appeal to common consensus today darling, conjure up something of substance or fold. Your call, IDC either way.

going by this logic TPM kenobi could content with (at least) TPM sidious or plagueis .

No reason to presume Vader is at that level of efficiency.

i think i don´t need to point out how ridiculous this sounds .

You don't darling, we all know every post you write is ridiculous.

@lorenzo.r.2nd I look forward to it.



@KingofBlades Merely expressing my freedom of speech and flaunting my sexuality in a humorous manner darling.

Spoiler:

DC77 wrote:You don't darling, we all know every post you write is ridiculous.

and you are still the clown of this forum . nothing changed .
i still find you unworthy of wasting my time and energy in a debate .
you are a spoiled teenage kid (who should have been permabanned long ago) . come back when you have some manners darling .

but in the meantime amuse me and tell me who is the strongest opponent TPM kenobi could beat according to your "great" scaling ?!
(no cheap shot , high ground shit etc. but fair fight) .

@dark_globe

and you are still the clown of this forum .

Thanks darling, clowns are cool. Am detecting some irony and self projection in this failure of an insult though.

nothing changed .

Me coming out as bi doesn't constitute as a change?

i still find you unworthy of wasting my time and energy in a debate .

Concession accepted.

you are a spoiled teenage kid .

Teenaged? Yes. Spoiled? Not really no.

come back when you have some manners darling .

Come back when you know how to debate without making a fool of yourself darling.

We get such productive discourse when insults start flowing don't we.

Man just won't accept that he got bodied by me the last 2 times we debated and let it go. He's still grasping at straws and pointing out attitude problems rather than just conceding he got stomped, as everybody but him agrees.

well you still failed to amuse me with answering the second part of my post .
so DC77 tell us who is the strongest opponent TPM kenobi could beat in your twisted universe ?

I thought the answer was obvious? Vader, duh.