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The Apprentice
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 22nd 2019, 12:07 pm
@The Divine Source

I think you may be jumping through a lot of hoops and ignoring a few things. wrote:

Care to elaborate?
XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 22nd 2019, 12:13 pm
There are more ways to prove there’s a huge gap between ROTS Yoda and TPM Yoda beyond just a feat comparison. There’s a lot of quote scaling that needs to be parsed through and rationalized.
TheGlory
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 22nd 2019, 3:34 pm
Tenebrous would likely outperform Dooku, imo by quite a margin, but has no chance of actually winning a fight against Yoda.
Azronger
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on April 23rd 2019, 1:09 am
@LOTL wrote:Give a small summary on why then

An exhausted Dooku managed to hold off Yoda for 40 seconds and fatigued him to the point that he struggled to lift a pillar in AotC. In RotS, Yoda scales above the Anakin who stomped Dooku (who was even more powerful in RotS than in AotC) in 12 seconds. Ergo, RotS Yoda is vastly more powerful than AotC Yoda.
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LOTL

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 8:01 am
How do you counter that Dooku was highly drained by the duel before in ROTS yet managed to last for around 15 seconds?

Also, I would love to see Yoda>IH Anakin. Evidence?
ILS
ILS

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 8:10 am
@LOTL wrote:Also, I would love to see Yoda>IH Anakin. Evidence?
Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 220px-10
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LOTL

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 8:40 am
It's the new thing apparently. People using the ROTS novel quotes and GL statements etc. to put Anakin above Yoda

ILS
ILS

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 10:03 am
Prose in RotS speaking from Anakin's viewpoint is not the same as objective sources telling us that Sheev is the most powerful Sith during RotS, and that Yoda is the most powerful Jedi/ultimate enemy of the dark side up to his time. Not aware of any GL statements telling us that Anakin can take Yoda.
DarthAnt66
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 10:07 am
Why do you think the prose is from Anakin's viewpoint?
LadyKulvax
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 10:19 am
I like how you use prose as a reason to discard Anakin's when the very Yoda quote you reference can be dismissed under exactly the same grounds.
ILS
ILS

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 10:27 am
@LadyKulvax wrote:I like how you use prose as a reason to discard Anakin's when the very Yoda quote you reference can be dismissed under exactly the same grounds.
I like how you seem to know more about which quote I'm referring to than I do, because that isn't the one.

@Ant Seems self-evident from reading it, no?
DarthAnt66
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on April 23rd 2019, 10:29 am
I thought you, Gideon, and I had discussed that and agreed that it was by the omniscient narrator, but I could be totally misremembering.

Remember the "woosh!" and all that, though?
dark-sith123
dark-sith123

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 10:43 am
Tenebrous can, in all likelihood, outperform Dooku, but Yoda still wins rather conclusively.
ILS
ILS

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 10:48 am
@DarthAnt66 wrote:I thought you, Gideon, and I had discussed that and agreed that it was by the omniscient narrator, but I could be totally misremembering.

Remember the "woosh!" and all that, though?
Woosh!Anakin is a whole other kettle of fish, and you know it.
DC77 (Reborn)
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 12:03 pm
Az's reasoning doesn't hold up to be entirely honest. Even if Yoda is>Anakin (Which I'm not even sure I agree with and won't until I see substantial evidence in his favour) the factors of exhaustion in both fights are unquantifiable next to each other, you can't conclude anything either way.
Azronger
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on April 23rd 2019, 12:13 pm
@LOTL wrote:How do you counter that Dooku was highly drained by the duel before in ROTS yet managed to last for around 15 seconds?

Also, I would love to see Yoda>IH Anakin. Evidence?

??

Dooku replenished his stamina right before Anakin cut loose. Where's it stated he was still fatigued there?
The Apprentice
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 12:19 pm
There's arguments against that though I'll save them for our CaV given you'll probably raise this point there.
O-Siri
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 12:41 pm
Here's the way I see it. Anakin may in-fact be more powerful than Yoda/Sidious, it's suggested multiple times not only in the novel but the movie itself. But the thing is power isn't everything in a fight as Gillard put it himself; it's mental as well. Mentally he hasn't gone past Obi-Wan and I think we can quite reasonably infer Yoda has the compete mastery of the mind in addition to his tier nine swordsmanship.

Kenobi has no chance of beating Sidious as the Dark Lord is not only more powerful but also more masterful. Anakin may have a chance at beating Sidious as he might very well be  more powerful despite his obvious mental disadvantage, if he has an edge in one area he has a chance, unlike Kenobi who has no edge in any department. Obi-Wan does however have a good chance of beating Anakin because he knows how to exploit his arrogance and is strong enough to hold his own in a grueling battle. While the novelization paints the battle as roughly equal, if you look back at the screenplay you will notice that Anakin was actually described as forcibly driving Kenobi back the entire time, in contrast to the novels depiction of Kenobi deliberately giving ground in keeping with his style. I'm not arguing one's more canon than the other, but it's interesting to point out in the face of the suggestion that Anakin should have been portrayed as a clear superior to Kenobi; thing is he was but like Luke vs Vader in ESB the underdog can still get his rounds in and as it happens all the time in real life the inferior fighter can still win if he does everything right and the superior does enough wrong.
ILS
ILS

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 12:46 pm
Kilius wrote:Here's the way I see it. Anakin may in-fact be more powerful than Yoda/Sidious, it's suggested multiple times not only in the novel but the movie itself. But the thing is power isn't everything in a fight as Gillard put it himself; it's mental as well. Mentally he hasn't gone past Obi-Wan and I think we can quite reasonably infer Yoda has the compete mastery of the mind in addition to his tier nine swordsmanship.
Agreed. He absolutely is "more powerful", he has more raw power available to draw and sitting dormant within him... but that doesn't actually speak to how well he can use that power in a fight.
DC77 (Reborn)
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 12:51 pm
IH Anakin was pretty much the embodiment of clarity and the closest he ever got to achieving mastery of his power though. While you'd probably be correct in saying any other version of Anakin would lose to Yoda or Sheev due to lack of mastery the novel pretty much says in big black letters that Anakin is free of mental restrictions at the end of his duel with Dooku when he decides Dooku should die. That's the version being discussed and I'm not convinced he'd lose to Yoda.
The Witness
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 1:01 pm
Yoda kills him
Isv
Isv

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 1:01 pm
Yoda kills just about anyone
DarthAnt66
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 1:03 pm
DC77 wrote:IH Anakin was pretty much the embodiment of clarity and the closest he ever got to achieving mastery of his power though. While you'd probably be correct in saying any other version of Anakin would lose to Yoda or Sheev due to lack of mastery the novel pretty much says in big black letters that Anakin is free of mental restrictions at the end of his duel with Dooku when he decides Dooku should die. That's the version being discussed and I'm not convinced he'd lose to Yoda.
KFV has far greater mental clarity and control than even IH Anakin.
DC77 (Reborn)
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 1:05 pm
@DarthAnt66 The topic of discussion is Jedi Anakin, if I'm following the conversation properly, rendering KFV's mental clarity irrelevant.
DarthAnt66
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Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 Empty Re: Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda

on April 23rd 2019, 1:06 pm
DC77 wrote:@DarthAnt66 The topic of discussion is Jedi Anakin, if I'm following the conversation properly, rendering KFV's mental clarity irrelevant.

Darth Tenebrous vs. Yoda - Page 2 1289255181 My bad. I wasn't sure if you were including KFV or not. Some people do think IH Anakin has greater clarity than KFV, hence my clarification.
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