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PeraltaEagle45
PeraltaEagle45

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:28 am
Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu 11227610

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Mace_w10
Isv
Isv

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:55 am
Nihilus, not a debate
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:37 am
Nihilus' TK feats are too OP, tbh.
The Apprentice
The Apprentice
Level Two
Level Two

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:07 am
Nihilus is too stronk.
XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:09 am
I fear Mace ultimately becomes another quick meal for the Dark Lord.
Azronger
Azronger
Moderator
Moderator

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:09 pm
Michael the Demiurge wrote:I fear Mace ultimately becomes another quick meal for the Dark Lord.

How's Nihilus going to win this "quickly"?
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LOTL

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:26 pm
I can't really see Nihilus beating Mace with the force, let alone quickly assuming Anakin taught the technique of drain resistance to the rest of the Jedi and there is no reason to assume he didn't.

Certainly not before Mace closes the gap to curbstomp him in conventional combat
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:39 pm
Yeah, because a technique that only somewhat delayed the effects of the Dark Reaper at a considerable distance is the same as taking on a far more powerful, concentrated drain.
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Meatpants
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:48 pm
Nihilus’ drain is unique to Trayus teachings as well, AFAIK.
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:54 pm
Indeed. That's why the Sith Empire were desperate to obtain his holocron. Conversely the Jedi were desperate to prevent them.
O-Siri
O-Siri

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:02 pm
@LOTL wrote:I can't really see Nihilus beating Mace with the force, let alone quickly assuming Anakin taught the technique of drain resistance to the rest of the Jedi and there is no reason to assume he didn't.

Certainly not before Mace closes the gap to curbstomp him in conventional combat

Well in the final level it's made clear that Anakin is the only one who can get near that thing without dying:



(Skip to 9:20)

Anakin had plenty of time to teach the Jedi the Sith technique before the Thule campaign but evidently couldn't. No real reason to assume Mace or anyone learned it from him.
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LOTL

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:13 pm
Yeah I see no reason to assume he can teach them the technique or that they can master the technique in days not to mention the problem of teaching it to everyone being an incredibly huge issue. There is also learning rates, his ability as a teacher and other factors to consider. Him learning it in such a short amount of time cannot mean everyone can obviously
MasterCilghal
MasterCilghal
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:07 pm
Nihilus. Even without drain his feats are better
BreakofDawn
BreakofDawn
Level Two
Level Two

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:10 pm
Prime Mace is a fair bit stronger in the Force and infinitely more skilled with a blade. If he can get close, he wins. If not, Nihilus' drain kills him. Mace might be a lot more powerful, but he has no way to defend against the draining technique.
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Meatpants
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:20 pm
I honestly can’t see Nihilus dying to a lightsaber. Seems like he’s beyond physical limitations, even if he did encase his essence in his armour and mask.
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:38 pm
@BreakofDawn wrote:Prime Mace is a fair bit stronger in the Force and infinitely more skilled with a blade. If he can get close, he wins. If not, Nihilus' drain kills him. Mace might be a lot more powerful, but he has no way to defend against the draining technique.

How is Windu stronger than Nihilus?
ILS
ILS

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:51 pm
I'd bet on Mace. He had a damn good shot at killing the most powerful Sith in history and weathered his Force attacks. Nihilus' martial abilities are absolutely woeful compared to Mace's. His only shot is his savant deathfield/cloud/drain ability, which while very powerful on a vast scale, remains untested against a single, extremely powerful individual. Even providing the Drain has some kind of effect on Mace, Nihilus will have trouble implementing it while he's under fire and Mace should be powerful enough to close the gap before becoming so weakened he would lose in a lightsaber duel.
BreakofDawn
BreakofDawn
Level Two
Level Two

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:59 pm
@LadyKulvax wrote:
@BreakofDawn wrote:Prime Mace is a fair bit stronger in the Force and infinitely more skilled with a blade. If he can get close, he wins. If not, Nihilus' drain kills him. Mace might be a lot more powerful, but he has no way to defend against the draining technique.

How is Windu stronger than Nihilus?

Scaling off of Sidious. ILS summed it up.
LadyKulvax
LadyKulvax
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:00 pm
Nihilus' Force feats dwarf Windu's.

Windu in his final battle was fighting with a whole bunch of circumstances fueling his ability to contend with Sheev. But in the end it's made very clear that Vaapad, and himself on the best day of his life, couldn't handle Sheev ramping up his lightning to full potency. Nor is he as strong as Yoda, who was Sheev's equal.

So trying the 'parity with most powerful ever' argument doesn't work when put through its paces.
BreakofDawn
BreakofDawn
Level Two
Level Two

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:39 pm
@LadyKulvax
Nihilus' Force feats dwarf Windu's.

And? Sidious is > Nihilus, that's indisputable, and Mace is a rival of his.

Windu in his final battle was fighting with a whole bunch of circumstances fueling his ability to contend with Sheev.

Virtually all of which I've debunked or countered more times than I can count.

But in the end it's made very clear that Vaapad, and himself on the best day of his life, couldn't handle Sheev ramping up his lightning to full potency.

That's not even remotely true. Mace was caught with his pants down, having a split second to react to block Sidious' lightning and holding his lightsaber in a compromising defensive position while exhausted. It's never once suggested a rested prime Mace couldn't go toe to toe with Sidious, and if you want to argue that cite a quote from either the author or the novel to confirm that. There's literally a quote from Lucas - who was closely involved in the novel's production - confirming Mace is around Yoda/Sidious level.

Nor is he as strong as Yoda, who was Sheev's equal.

Which is contrasted by about a dozen quotes who put him around Yoda's level by the time of TPM and AOTC, and Lucas' own confirmation that ROTS Mace is a peer of Yoda and Sidious'.

So trying the 'parity with most powerful ever' argument doesn't work when put through its paces.

Except it does.
The Apprentice
The Apprentice
Level Two
Level Two

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:31 pm
Chee has said Sidious's supremacy quotes are subjective and has also repeatedly said supremacy quotes aren't absolute. I don't think arguing Mace~Sheev>Nihilus makes for a very compelling argument especially since Nihilus's feats arguably surpass ROTS Sidious's by a significant margin.
slayne
slayne

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:21 am
Mace probably takes it if he's a legitimate Sidious-tier combatant absent any extenuating circumstance. Otherwise, Nihilus overwhelms him with debatable ease.
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Meatpants
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:49 am
Windu isn't Sidious tier at base combative ability, no.
PeraltaEagle45
PeraltaEagle45

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:54 am
MP wrote:Windu isn't Sidious tier at base combative ability, no.

He's easily Sidious TIER. The question is whether or not he's Sidious' equal or better.
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Meatpants
Level One
Level One

Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

on Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:54 am
No he isn't.
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Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu Empty Re: Darth Nihilus vs. Mace Windu

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