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DarthAnt66
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 28th 2019, 12:54 pm
SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Kreia_10


  • Darth Traya as of Knights of the Old Republic II, but before losing her arm, backed by @MasterCilghal.
  • Jaina Solo as of Fate of the Jedi - Apocalypse, backed by @Xolthol.
MasterCilghal
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 28th 2019, 2:27 pm
Thank you for making it.
DC77 (Reborn)
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 28th 2019, 2:53 pm
Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)
TAEP, should be interdasking.
MasterCilghal
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 28th 2019, 3:04 pm
DC77 wrote:TAEP, should be interdasking.
The main objective of this thread is to promote Traya, I think she’s a bit underestimated.
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 29th 2019, 1:14 am
@DarthAnt66: Thanks for making the thread.
@mastercilghal: do you want to open the fight ?
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 29th 2019, 2:00 am
@xolthol wrote:@DarthAnt66: Thanks for making the thread.
@mastercilghal: do you want to open the fight? 
Yeah I prefere to start myself. I’ll write the openerer in a few days. But  If you prefere to start i’ll let you do it.
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 29th 2019, 4:30 pm
@mastercilghal: It's ok you can begin.
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on April 29th 2019, 5:10 pm
@xolthol wrote:@mastercilghal: It's ok you can begin.
Thank you.
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 1st 2019, 5:03 am
@Xolthol I started to today writing the opener, it will soon be ready.
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 1st 2019, 5:20 am
MasterCilghal
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 8th 2019, 5:40 am
@xolthol i’ve been sick in the last few days, and I was unable to continue writing my opener, I hope i’ll be able to post it by Saturday. Sorry for the wait.
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 8th 2019, 10:37 am
@mastercilghal no problem
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 13th 2019, 3:48 pm
@mastercilghal: when will you release your opener ?
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 13th 2019, 3:59 pm
@xolthol wrote:@mastercilghal: when will you release your opener ?
I’ve almost finished it, but I’ve had a lot of problems with the images. This week i’m very busy, but I hope to get it out by next week. Again, I could sound repetitive, but i’m terribly sorry for the inconvenience.
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 13th 2019, 4:25 pm
No problem... Tbh I'm also busy this week so this isn't a problem at all. I just want to be sure that you are in the match.
MasterCilghal
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 9:17 am
Preface
First of all, i would like to say that the main reason behind the creation of this showdown, at least for me, was to promote Darth Traya as a combatant, since, based on discussions I’ve seen in the past, she certainly is underrated. As for this opener’s material, I won’t put many of Kreia’s accolades and feats( since there are so many) , but rather same then for subsequent posts.I also wanted to greatly thank @nova for his “Darth Traya respect thread” , which helped me a lot when constructing this argument. Having said that, let’s begin. I also wanted to apologize with Xolthol for the long wait, but the amount of homework I had to do prevented me from getting this post ready. I hope you all enjoy it. 


Accolades and knowledge


 A) accolades: Although Traya’s true strength lies in her feats, she has a good number of decent accolades, both in regards to her power and skill. In this analysis, I’m gonna bring up one of, if not the most interesting of Kreia’s accolades, taken directly from the complete Star Wars encyclopedia:  SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 8ff27910

 This quote can be interpreted in two different ways: 
1-Traya (while in the Trayus academy) is more powerful than Nihilus and Sion, which is extremely impressive given the two sith lords’ power, and it would make sense given that it took the combined efforts of Sion and Nihilus to defeat her. Of course on neutral ground it doesn’t apply but it would mean she at least in he same tier as Nihilus under normal circumstances. 
2- Traya was more powerful than the exile during their confrontation, which would also make sense when we consider that throughout the story, Kreia’s superiority over the exile is pretty clear (link ), at least not until the very end. 


B) knowledge: Kreia’s force knowledge, thanks to her years of both Jedi and sith training/study and the fact that she was an historian, is simply incredible. 
In fact, she was noted to have studied, like every master of the era,  the Jedi archives:

"The archives here are restricted to those who have attained the rank of Master. We must protect overeager Padawans from being exposed to dangerous knowledge. The pursuit of knowledge is a noble goal, but there are some things that require the wisdom of a Master to truly understand."
Source: Knights of the Old Republic
Deep within the Jedi Enclave Sublevel lies an archive of knowledge that few have seen.
Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords: Prima Official Game guide


In addition to this, Kreia studied extensively sith lore on such notable planets as Telos, Korriban and the Trayus academy on Malachor V, all of whom planets that were specifically noted to contain enormous knowledge about the sith: 

Within its Trayus Academy, she encounters assassins left by Darth Revan, but instead of attacking, they present her with Sith hermetica. "The truth of the cosmos", these writings intimated, "are not intended for the sane." Intrigued, Kreia scours the texts through the Force, suspecting their authors were in fact pureblood descendants of the Sith people.
Source: Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide
Korriban holds few secrets from me... but much that you should learn."
Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
These holocrons hold much of the Sith... and they hold much of my teachings, from long ago."
Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords

"Kreia is setting the stage for what we imagined KOTOR3 to be, and as we had a sense for the power that we wanted those Sith Lords to reveal, her predictions are accurate. And yes, she had a number of Sith holocrons that she had read (the ones on Telos)."
It is important to point out that all the holocrons present there contained informations on combat techniques, as noted by master Atris, who studied them specifically to combat the sith:
 "All this collected knowledge, all these teachings of combat and the Force - they are mine to command."
Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
At this point, You may be asking yourself why I brought up her knowledge in the first place. The answer is simple: as I will explain later, it’s going to provide her with an advantage against Jaina. 
Force feats: Dantooine 


As you are probably aware, Darth Traya was many compelling feats in regards to her command of the force, but since this  is just an opener I’m gonna focus on  the most substantial one: that being her ability to ragdoll the three Jedi masters Vrook, Kavar and Zez-kai Ell. First of all, here is the sequence:  


SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 5458092-4714374903-giphy



1)explanation 
Although in the official version she only appears to blast them away, the original version ( which didn’t came out only because of the need for an early release, and therefore can be used) depicts her literally doing what I described earlier, holding all of them at once with little effort, which proves  she can indeed ragdoll them.


SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 3892041-9kaae




 Furthermore, the fact that she could instantly drain them afterwards  further proves she could have tossed them around at any moment, and apparently with little difficulty. 

2) how powerful those jedi masters are? 
What makes this feat so impressive is the fact that all of those three Jedi masters have great accolades in regards to their power in the force and share a particularly impressive feat. 
First of all, Kavar is noted to possess particularly advanced force powers: 
Kavar isn't as much of a lightsaber virtuoso as the other Jedi masters you've met, but he makes up for this with his extremely potent Force powers.

Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords: Prima Official Game Guide
 In KOTOR 1, the three Jedi are noted to be some of the most powerful in the order:
"Even the Sith would think twice before attacking Dantooine. There are many Jedi here, including several of the most powerful Masters of the Order. There is great strength within this place."

Source: Knights of the Old Republic
Later, after Kreia drains them with the force, she notes it had to be done because she could not have let such powerful Jedi masters live:
"Regardless.... it had to be done. To have such powerful Jedi still live, still be felt in the Force even on dead worlds as they had chosen, was a threat that had to be ended."

Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
Lastly, in what is possibly their most impressive feat, they are implied to have rebuilt the Jedi enclave on Dantooine in a short amount of time, which had been destroyed by Darth Malak during the Jedi civil war. I won’t explain  my reasoning, but simply give you a link to a blog made by Nova, who i greatly thank again, where it is explained how any of the three could have done it single-handledly (link ). Overall, those three Jedi are among the best of the era and possess sufficient power to move the stones of a massive Jedi enclave. 
To conclude this section, the scaling is: Kreia>>>>Dantooine jedi masters
This gives you an idea of just how powerful Kreia is and how much telekinetic power she can muster up. 
Lightsaber skill


Traya’s main area of expertise, as has already been made clear is her command of the force. Having said that, she has some good accolades in regards to her lightsaber skill. 
 under the name of Arren Kae she was noted as a skilled warrior: 
And she was said to be... a skilled warrior. Beautiful. And strong in the Force."

Source: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
Secondly, the sith of that era obtained their rank by proving themselves among the most skilled with a lightsaber, which probably included Kreia: 
Meanwhile, Sith survivors wage civil war, culling the weak and electing leadership by the lightsaber's blade.

Source: Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide
Although Kreia does not have many feats in the game, we can infer that, as she is the final and toughest opponent in the game, that she’s pretty skilled. 
Furthermore, Kreia has extensive knowledge of the lightsaber forms, which she taught to the exile (link ), was known to have wielded a double bladed lightsaber as a Jedi, was a master of the rare and difficult trakata tecnique, and kinetic  combat , all of them being practices that require advanced mastery:
SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Aec0ba10




Why she wins 


Now that I’ve provided you with a few feats on Kreia’s power, let’s examine the reasons for why she most likely wins this fight: 


  • First of all, the amount of knowledge Kreia possesses, in regards to force techniques far exceeds Jaina’s own. Even the most knowledgeable jedi in the NJO, Tionne Solusar, noted how much knowledge and holocrons had been lost after the galactic civil war:

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 746b7210



  • Furthermore, the primary reason for why Jaina trained with the mandalorians was her total lack of knowledge of the force techniques Caedus could employ against her in their upcoming confrontation. This means Kreia has access to a far greater repertoire of unorthodox force techniques, many of whom can be applied combatively. Telepathic attacks like force fear can be used to off-balance Jaina, while force drain ( against which Jaina has no defense) can be used to weaken her, in a similar way to how Krayt used the technique against Abeloth and Luke Skywalker ( link ). 
  • Kreia, while maybe not Jaina’s equal with the lightsaber, is still a capable opponent and can compensate by employing techniques such as trakata to off-balance Jaina. 


  • Her telekinetic feats and scaling are just...better. Jaina was clearly inferior to a massively weakened Caedus during their final duel (link ) has had difficulty with the featless (at least in this area) Alema Rar and her best telekinetic feat in her prime was sending parts of a collapses wall flying in backlash and force pushing sith sabers, so nothing points to a massive power growth between LOTF and FOTJ and It’s not that great in comparison to what Traya has done (which will be explored further in subsequent posts). In fact, Jaina herself conceded inferiority to the Jedi masters on the council and even some jedi knights in invincible, opponents Kreia would ragdoll with contemptuous ease. 

Overall, the odds are against Jaina’s victory and it could be argued Traya’s victory is downright easy. 


Last edited by mastercilghal on May 25th 2019, 9:53 am; edited 2 times in total
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 9:18 am
Here are the tags: @Xolthol ( good luck with your response) @DC77 @Meatpants
MasterCilghal
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 9:51 am
I had to edit it because the gifs didn’t work.
xolthol
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 10:42 am
@mastercilghal: This seems good... I didn't know when answering but will try asap.
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 10:56 am
@xolthol wrote:@mastercilghal: This seems good... I didn't know when answering but will try asap.
Don’t worry, take your time. It would be rather hypocritical from me to expect you to get the post out soon.
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 11:52 am
I'd rather fuck Jaina

*Oh wait this is a fight... umm... good luck you two.


Last edited by LSDMB on May 25th 2019, 12:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
MasterCilghal
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on May 25th 2019, 11:58 am
@LSDMB thank you
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xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on June 9th 2019, 5:44 am
@mastercilghal: I will try to post my response in next two days. Sorry for the time that I take (I'm really busy IRL).
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SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on June 9th 2019, 6:18 am
@xolthol wrote:@mastercilghal: I will try to post my response in next two days. Sorry for the time that I take (I'm really busy IRL).
Don’t worry, take your time.
xolthol
xolthol

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Empty Re: SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol)

on June 12th 2019, 1:01 pm
First of all, I want to apologize for the time that I've taken in order to respond to @mastercilghal, but real life has is own rythmus and I cannot reply earlier. But anyway lets jump into the fournace...

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Jaina___hard_landing_wip_by_josephb222_d1cf9iz-350t.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9OTYxIiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvMzFjYzIyNDMtNmZjNC00OGRiLWE4OWMtNGE3MjBlNzhhYTkzXC9kMWNmOWl6LTc1Y2YzMjIwLTE4YTctNDlkYy1hN2ZlLWU2NjE5Y2EyNGZjNC5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTAyNCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19

*Starting the slaughter.... *


I will here made my opening and explain why Jaina will win this fight. Because I didn't think this is the place and time to do this, I won't respond directly to what my opponent bring in his own opening. I will divided my post in two parts: first of all a brief view of how powerful Jaina is then a more concrete analysis of what give her the win here. With all of that said, lets start the fight slaughter.

~Sword of the Jedi~


"I name you the Sword of the Jedi. You are like tempered steel, purposeful and razor-keen. Always you shall be in the front rank, a burning brand to your enemies, a brilliant fire to your friends. Yours is a restless life, and never shall you know peace, though you shall be blessed for the peace that you bring to others. Take comfort in the fact that, though you stand tall and alone, others take shelter in the shadow that you cast."

Top dog of the Jedi Order


Jaina Solo, grand daughter of Darth Vader is whitout a doubt a great warrior as shown by the title that she earned, the sword of the Jedi. But she has more than just this simple title, she has also this accolade:

Fate of the Jedi: Apocalypse wrote:Jaina Solo, who, as Sword of the Jedi, had proven time and again that she was the combat equal of anyone in the Order.

What this quote gives us to know ? First of all, we learn that at this time, Jaina is the "combat equal" of anyone
[*]in the Jedi order. This clearly emphazise  her fighting capacity, not on her diplomacy skills or even that she is the closest to the perfect jedi. This even didn't proove that she is the more powerful force user of the Order. This expression gives us way more usefull information. Indeed, as a fact we know that in a fight (which include the use of the Force, your lightsaber, your martial knowledge and your environnement ) so in an all out, she is the equal of anyone.
Obviously she cannot be at the same time the equal of  younglings and the equal of masters... The quote refer to the fact that she is the equal to any top fighting Jedi masters, which include:  Kyp Durron,  Saba Sebatyne, Kyle Katarn. (I think that we can agree on the fact that this three jedi are the very top of the order at this time). Because of this we know that Jaina is able to fight at least[**] as an equal with someone as powerful in the force as Kyp, as resilient and physically dominant as Saba and as with as knowldge in the lightsaber as Kyle.  So we can see that Jaina is a really complete fighter who can deal with any sort of ennemy that she faced.
And the most interresting part in this is the fact that Jaine had proven more than once this equality to anyone in the Order. So this isn't questionable at all.

[*]Nota bene 1:

A common way used by people to dismiss this quote is by saying that Jaina isn't the combat equal of her uncle Luke Skywalker based on this quotes:

She [Jaina Solo] had thought she had a fair understanding of his Force abilities, but if his flying was any example, he hadn't revealed half of what he could do. Maybe not even a quarter.

Legacy of the Force: Inferno

...what might Luke Skywalker, the most famous, most powerful, and most experienced living Jedi, do...

Fate of the Jedi: Outcast

"Luke Skywalker is still the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy. I think we should assume he has a plan," Jaina said.

Fate of the Jedi: Vortex

But this reasonning is clearly false based on a simple fact. During the time of FotJ Luke Skywalker wasn't in the Jedi Order. He left in exile because he think that he had failed his duty by letting his nephew Jacen Solo becoming the sith lord Darth Caedus. So he isn't in the Order anymore and the quote is still valid.

[**]Nota bene 2:
I have used "at least" in order to made explain something that must be taking into account: the quote undirectly explain that Jaina is the above most of the members of the jedi order by using the rethoric figure which made her equal to the top jedi of the order. But we can also legitimately think that this rethoric figure can apply also to the top Jedi, which will make Jaina their superior and the best Jedi of the order from a combative point of view.

A brief scaling


Let me introduce the Community, a group of clones who are physical copy of some force users such as Kyle Katarn, Kam Solusar and Jaden Korr. Even though they are clone, they can use the Force in pretty impressive way.

Khedryn Faal wrote:"They combined Jedi DNA with something else and grew it into clones. Dangerous clones."

Star Wars: Crosscurrent

A- RUNNER

Runner is the clone of Kyle and even though he has a wide array of capacities, one of his most devastating was his telekinesis. I will just take a single feats in order to show you just how powerful Runner is.

Runner made a sweeping gesture with one hand, and the Weequay's speeder looked as if it had been hit broadside with an enormous wave. It teetered on its side and slid across the street, onto the sidewalk, crushing several pedestrians, and into an adjacent building. Metal shrieked and bent. Glass shattered. The building half-collapsed with an angry rumble.

Star Wars: Riptide

This feat can be seen as not really impressive but when you look cautionly, it is really insane. First of all, Runner didn't push the speeder all the time, he just give it the first (and only) impulse. Then the speeder wasn't flying at all, he was sliding on the ground so the physical friction must had take a important part of the initial energy. Last but clearly not least the speeder hit a building and because of this the building half collapsed. And this wasn't because of some explosion: Metal shrieked and bent. Glass shattered this was only because of the sheer speed and weight of the speeder.
Basically, what he have done here prove that he can easily with a single push half-destroy a building. And he is far from working at his full power.

B- SOLDIER

Another clone was called Soldier, he was the clone of Jaden Korr. And this clone is the best of all clones so he is obviously better than Runner.

He(Soldier) was different from the others. They knew it and he knew it. He was the best of them, the final specimen created by the doctors

Star Wars: Riptide

C-JADEN KORR

Now lets see a TK confrontation between Jaden and the two clones:


"On the stairway above him and to his left, Jaden saw the clone he had dazed rise to his feet and shake his head, growling. His angry eyes fixed on Jaden. He gestured with both hands, and sent a burst of power at the Jedi.

Jaden held out his left hand—his maimed hand—at the last moment, intercepted the blast, and answered with his own power. The clone’s push caused him to stagger, but he nested himself in the Force and stood his ground against both clones. He held his hands out, the clones’ power pressing at him from right angles. The yellow line of his lightsaber, which he still held in his left had, sizzled before his eyes. The effort squeezed sweat from him, taxed mind and body. He took a step back, another, and found himself pressed against the wall. He could not hold out for long.
[...]
As one, the two male clones took a step toward Jaden, their power pressing against him. He fell to one knee, grunting against their onslaught, barely holding on.

They took another step and he fell to both knees.

The larger of the two grinned. Jaden recognized him now, behind the beard and hair. He was a clone of Jaden’s Master, Kyle Katarn. Anger poured off both clones, anger born of years of frustration and mistreatment. It hit Jaden like a hailstorm. His elbows bent. He was failing, failing.

But he refused to give in.

He grunted, summoned a reserve of strength, extended his arms fully, pushed back against the clones, stood up, and held his ground.

“I won’t let you pass,” he grunted. “I can’t.”

Star Wars: Riptide

Basically, you can see that even the combine might of the two clones isn't enough to defeat in a sheer TK competiton Jaden Korr. In addition to this, you need to acknowledge two things:

  1. The sum of the power of the clone is less than the power of their sum (basically what we call constructive addition : 1 + 1 > 2). This is explain here:
    He stared at his fingers in wonder, grinning. The emotions of the other clones reached through their community's shared empathic connection and bombarded him with feeling. He felt their glee, their ecstasy, their anger. His emotions fed on theirs, and theirs on his, a never-ending feedback loop, an ouroboros of emotional energy that made him feel as if he were boiling inside, filling with emotional steam

    Star Wars: Riptide

  2. The blast that Jaden resist is just way bigger than the one throw by Runner, this is a continuous TK strike and a under lots of intense emotions : Anger poured off both clones, anger born of years of frustration and mistreatment. It hit Jaden like a hailstorm.


With that in mind we have now this scaling chain:

Jaden >~ (Soldier + Runner) in rage mode > (Soldier + Runner) > 2x Runner >>>>>> Crushing a whole building.

D- Jaina Solo

As shown in the previous part, Jaina is around Kyp/Kyle/Saba level of fighter. So she is clearly above someone as powerful as Jaden Korr.
If you want to argue that  sheer power isn't everything in a fight, I will agree, but Jaden is far from being a shitty fighter. In fact he is exactly the opposite: he is an awesome fighter.
Indeed he faced and defeat Boba Fett (you know, the guy who fought against Vader and survive)

(At 5:43, you will see Boba Fett defeat by Jaden Korr)


Boba fighting Vader:

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 6552916-boba%20fett%20paries%20vader
SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 6552931-3956340-boba%2Bvs%2Bvader5

All of this show you just how good is Jaden as a fighter. If you add to this his insane force power and you have a monster that is still below Jaina Solo.

~Facing Darth Traya~



Power of Traya ?


Even though, I said that I won't counter your first post, I will just adress a part of it that you didn't directly write. I'm obviously talking to the blog done by Nova about the rebuilding of the Jedi enclave on Datoine. Tbh I find this theory absolutely stupid and fan-based... I will say that it biggest mistakes lay on the fact that building an enclave isn't only a matter of power (the one to lift stones). It is mainly a matter of building skills, putting the right stone at the right place then applying the right amount of cement. Clearly it is possible for the jedi masters to have help rebuilding this place but this is absolutely illogic to think that they have been able to rebuilt it on their own and in only a matter of hours... just ridiculous.
If I take this out for Traya, she haven't any real good feat:


  • Slaughtering three jedi masters with some random quotes... Not really impressive and absolutely not relevant when comparing to Jaden feat.
  • Having some quotes for her... every characters which are at least a bit important have one or two
  • being defeated by a far from prime Nihilius... not a feat at all. She only survive because Nihilius didn't consider her as a threat.


Clearly she haven't anything in term of power that can allow her to compete with Jaina.


A combative failure versus an accomplish fighter


But even though you can prove that Traya is more powerful than Jaina (which is clearly not the case), you will still need to explain how she can defeat Jaina while she failed to win against the jedi Exile Meetra Surik.
And all the problem of Traya is resume in her fight against Surik:
-> she is factually more powerful than Meetra

"Although Traya was more powerful, the Exile managed to defeat her in combat."

Kotor Campaign Guide

-> she faced her on the Dark Side nexus of Malachor V which is known to be immensely powerful, particularly in the Trayus core:
"There is a place in the galaxy where the dark side of the Force runs strong. It is something of the Sith, but it was fueled by war. It corrupts all that walks on its surface—drowns them in the power of the dark side. It corrupts all life, and it feeds on death."

Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic 2

The nexus of Trayus Academy, the core is a clawlike altar built over a colossal geyser of dark side energy. It is here that you face your ultimate battle and fulfill your destiny"

The Prima Official Game Guide
The nexus must have amp insanely Traya and weakened even more the Exile.

-> Before facing Traya she have face countless ennemies, all amp by the Dark Side of the Force.

"Trayus Academy is the home of those Jedi who have succumbed the to dark side taint of Malachor V. To reach the structure's core, where Darth Sion and Kreia await, you must face a legion of elite Sith single-handedly. Skills and subtlety may have served you well previously, but here there is no substitute for raw destructive power, whether through combat feats or Force attacks. Only by fighting your way through the Sith's strongest guardians can you earn the right to confront your nemesis."

The KOTOR 2 Prima Official Game Guide

"Constant battles with numerous Sith assassins are the rule here"

The KOTOR 2 Prima Official Game Guide

And this sith have been specialy trained to defeat jedi:

"These surreptitious butchers specialize in practical modes of Jedi execution."

"The most elite of these assassins are the Bladeborn - Sith blademasters"

The Kotor Campaign Guide

To sum up all of this we have:

DS amp Traya >> Normal Traya > Meetra Surik >> DS Hindered Surik > Tired of countless fight DS Hindered Surik.

And even with all of this advantages, Traya loose ! She must be a real failure.
Clearly in order to defeat Jaina she will need to be way above her in term of raw force power, but to an extend that will made DE sheev looks like a youngling.

Clearly there is zero way for Jaina to loose this fight.

CONCLUSION


As shwon above, this will be a slaughter. Jaina have both the power and the skill to take down Traya. This latter just cannot compete with the Sword of the Jedi. I think that @mastercilghal should concede this match before loosing more  SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) 3750555731

SS - Darth Traya (MasterCilghal) vs Jaina Solo (Xolthol) Jaina___first_duel__wip_by_josephb222_d1f6xij-fullview.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9ODcyIiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvMzFjYzIyNDMtNmZjNC00OGRiLWE4OWMtNGE3MjBlNzhhYTkzXC9kMWY2eGlqLTgzODQ0YjJjLTE3ZDgtNDAyOS04YWU3LWQ4ZjdjNmVlZGVhYi5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9OTAwIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmltYWdlLm9wZXJhdGlvbnMiXX0
@mastercilghal : Your moove Sir...

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